'Cept for the time he saved that puppy.
I gave her everything... jewels, beautiful dresses -- with beautiful girls in them.
Spike ,'Sleeper'
Buffy and Angel 1: BUFFYNANGLE4EVA!!!!!1!
Is it better the second time around? Or the third? Or tenth? This is the place to come when you have a burning desire to talk about an old episode that was just re-run.
Daisy Jane - May 09, 2005 7:46:38 pm PDT #606 of 10458
"This bar smells like kerosene and stripper tears."
Alibelle - May 09, 2005 8:11:24 pm PDT #607 of 10458
Apart from sports, "my secret favorite thing on earth is ketchup. I will put ketchup on anything. But it has to be Heinz." - my husband, Michael Vartan
I heart Heather! Now I'm giggling all over again, remembering that scene.
Of course, the argument could be made that in saving the puppy, he was saving himself. Since he's just a big fluffy puppy with bad teeth, etc.
Frankenbuddha - May 10, 2005 2:48:59 am PDT #608 of 10458
"We are the Goon Squad and we're coming to town...Beep! Beep!" - David Bowie, "Fashion"
Mmmm, loving the spicy brains on display here, I must say.
Vortex - May 10, 2005 5:17:43 am PDT #609 of 10458
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman
For those mentioning that Angel killed Darla to save Buffy: do you think that if Buffy was holding a stake over Darla's chest, Angel would have let it happen? It's genuine question, not a "nyah," because I'm genuinely not sure. I feel like if he didn't have time to think (insert cheap shot here) he'd have automatically stepped in there, too.
he may have stopped Buffy, but he wouldn't have killed her. But, then, one could argue that the only to stop Darla was to kill her. Interesting question. Let us ruminate.
Lee - May 10, 2005 6:13:15 am PDT #610 of 10458
The feeling you get when your brain finally lets your heart get in its pants.
Mmmm, loving the spicy brains on display here, I must say.
What Frank said. This has been/will keep being really fun.
sumi - May 10, 2005 6:40:36 am PDT #611 of 10458
Art Crawl!!!
Amazon just alerted me to order the Angel soundtrack album, "Live Fast, Die Never".
It has the Christian Kane song! And Lorne singing "It's not easy being green!"
-t - May 10, 2005 6:40:38 am PDT #612 of 10458
I am a woman of various inclinations and only some of the time are they to burn everything down in frustration
I think that Angel's quest for atonement was also, partially, a quest for wholeness
I love this idea.
Something Plei (I think, I could be conflating) said sparked the thought that what AtS was really all about was Angel finding his own self-determination. To that end, he had to break free of trying to please Darla, or live up to Buffy, or follow the directives of the PTB and find his own way.
And I can almost tie that into the current discussion. He hadn't really broken free of Darla until, well, I'm not sure. Maybe libkitty is right and sleeping with her without going evil was the turning point. Maybe convincing her that she could live as a human even if she was dying (before Drusilla vamped her) gave him power over his internal Darla, as it were. In any case, when he got his soul back, it was Darla who left him, and he was both rudderless and without hope of winning her back. And when he left Buffy (any of the times he left Buffy, for that matter) it was for her sake. He had that abstracted idealized internal Buffy at least until the Girl in Question.
beathen - May 10, 2005 6:48:40 am PDT #613 of 10458
Sure I went over to the Dark Side, but just to pick up a few things.
Amazon just alerted me to order the Angel soundtrack album, "Live Fast, Die Never".
It has the Christian Kane song! And Lorne singing "It's not easy being green!"
It's already available to ship through Amazon UK. (I've had mine for about 2 months already.)
Strega - May 10, 2005 7:16:54 am PDT #614 of 10458
I guess what I'm trying to say is that for me, it seems as though Darla is very much a symbol in Angel's mind.
See, that's exactly how I think he saw Buffy: "If I can help the Heroic Princess and win her love, that will prove I'm Good now." He is the one with the fairy-tale mentality. Again, some of that is just because I can't understand what they actually liked about each other. There's a point at which I just throw up my hands and figure the hellmouth had something to do with it.
I do think he and Darla cared about each other a lot, though. In their own special way.
I mean, so much of their history together was tied up in not caring-- about each other, or anyone else.I thought they were like Valmont & Merteuil, y'know? They understood and respected each other at a profound level. I always had this problem where, to me, "Heartthrob" is about how they had one of the few mature relationships we saw on either show, but I'm not sure if it was intended that way or if I just have a few issues. Ahem.
But come on, she rescued him from Holtz; he almost ate a baby for her. That's gotta mean something.
Jessica - May 10, 2005 7:19:16 am PDT #615 of 10458
And then Ortus came and said "It's Ortin' time" and they all Orted off into the sunset
Again, some of that is just because I can't understand what they actually liked about each other. There's a point at which I just throw up my hands and figure the hellmouth had something to do with it.
Heh. Strega is me here.
I always found the B/A relationship confusing at best.