Too true. Can't get more different than Lennie and Billy Flynn!
Wash: Mal, your dead army buddy's on the bridge! Zoe: He ain't dead. Wash: Oh.
'The Message'
The Great Write Way, Chapter Two: Twice upon a time...
A place for Buffistas to discuss, beta and otherwise deal and dish on their non-fan fiction projects.
erikaj - Feb 16, 2005 2:53:33 pm PST #22 of 10001
Always Anti-fascist!
Susan W. - Feb 16, 2005 3:36:57 pm PST #23 of 10001
Good Trouble and Righteous Fights
Question for the group:
How many times could you handle a character reflecting on an event in her past without going into details--i.e. "On such-and-such a date, Everything Went Wrong"--before you tracked down the author at her home and beat her to death with a wet noodle for being unnecessarily coy? Once? Twice? Thrice? The Big Reveal, such as it is, is probably going to come at some point after page 100, because I want it to come from the heroine's lips, in conversation with the hero, when they've reached a degree of intimacy to justify Big Secrets. So I'm torn between, "If you hint more than once, people will hate you," and, "If you just have that one hint in Chapter One, your readers will have forgotten all about it by the time you get to the aftermath of the Might-As-Well-Be-Having-the-Sex scene."
erikaj - Feb 16, 2005 3:38:49 pm PST #24 of 10001
Always Anti-fascist!
I think I do it too much, Susan. You don't want my advice.
Connie Neil - Feb 16, 2005 3:42:42 pm PST #25 of 10001
brillig
I think probably once, if it's in the middle of the span to the Reveal, or twice, right near the beginning, then midway.
I've got a Wretched Big Secret in that original novel I'm working on, but chunks are being revealed as we go, kind of like a "My god, woman, how low did you let yourself sink?" kind of realization. Which is important, because she's going to come up against a line she won't cross and take action, a "this far and no farther" thing.
Why not have her mull over some of the lesser aspects of the Big Secret, something to tantalize the ghoulish into finding out the rest of the details?
Strix - Feb 16, 2005 3:43:36 pm PST #26 of 10001
A dress should be tight enough to show you're a woman but loose enough to flee from zombies. — Ginger
More than once, less than 4, sure, Susan. Unless it's a huge, whopping, "Back when I was...OOPS I almost revealed my BIG SECRET" hint, and then I think that would be enough.
When authors beat you over the head with a secret and (a) you figure it out too quickly or (b) they build up way too much for the reveal to justify the secret ("Wow -- so she dyes her hair? Huh.") that's crazymaking to me.
Susan W. - Feb 16, 2005 3:49:12 pm PST #27 of 10001
Good Trouble and Righteous Fights
When authors beat you over the head with a secret and (a) you figure it out too quickly or (b) they build up way too much for the reveal to justify the secret ("Wow -- so she dyes her hair? Huh.") that's crazymaking to me.And I'm worried about both of these. (a) because I'm not the first writer ever to use this particular secret at as a plot device, and (b) because if I'm not careful readers might think I'm hinting at something else that's a bigger deal, and would be kinda cool, plotwise, but would add more complications than this story needs and be out of character for Anna, besides.
Strix - Feb 16, 2005 3:52:14 pm PST #28 of 10001
A dress should be tight enough to show you're a woman but loose enough to flee from zombies. — Ginger
That's why you have good betas, doll. You're smart; you know the pitfalls. It'll be ok.
Hil R. - Feb 16, 2005 3:54:33 pm PST #29 of 10001
Sometimes I think I might just move up to Vermont, open a bookstore or a vegan restaurant. Adam Schlesinger, z''l
Yeah, that was one thing that drove me insane about The DaVinci Code (the "what she saw in her grandfather's basement" secret, which I figured out after about the second mention, but then there were about ten more mentions to read through, and then I was just disappointed when the big reveal didn't even have any details I didn't already know), but a little bit would be OK, as long as it was subtle. (I.e., a whole bunch of "she hadn't felt this happy in three years," or having her obviously change the subject when the conversation gets too close to whatever the secret is, or other things within her behavior, rather than just "There was something big that happened then" statements.)
deborah grabien - Feb 16, 2005 3:57:57 pm PST #30 of 10001
It really doesn't matter. It's just an opinion. Don't worry about it. Not worth the hassle.
Susan, does it have to be hinted at by her, or mused over by her? Can the existence of said secret be shown to the reader by way of "her face suddenly smoothed out, becoming blank" moments or incidents, as seen by others?
You know - something reminds her of The Secret and she goes all stony or whatever for a moment, and the reader wonders about it because the character she's interacting with is wondering about it?
Strix - Feb 16, 2005 3:58:14 pm PST #31 of 10001
A dress should be tight enough to show you're a woman but loose enough to flee from zombies. — Ginger
This whole conversation made me think "I STILL want to know what that old lady saw that was "nasty in the woodshed."
That was a great ambiguous way to build up suspense. Granted, we never found out, but it sure has hell kept me wondering. Maybe references to ordinary objects or places that build up a "some thing happened" suspense, but don't let the readers know too much, like "the sight of the lone pink bootie sent her into tears."