I have to say my own catechism classes were massively Teh Lame. All I remember from them is:

(a) memorizing the Apostles' Creed
(b) watching The Silent Scream
(c) watching a short movie starring Bob Newhart as God.

I think also, possibly, we sang Christmas carols at a retirement home across the street from the church.

Everything else I know about Catholicism is a freaky doctrinal patchwork stitched together out of bits of Chesterton, Flannery O'Connor, Thomas Merton, the Catholic Worker, Julian of Norwich, and my mother. I suspect my version of orthodoxy would make the Pope cry -- which is fair enough, as his certainly makes me cry.

I suspect my version of orthodoxy would make the Pope cry -- which is fair enough, as his certainly makes me cry.

A thousand hallelujiahs to this!

Cash, I love the violet hair. I could never do it, because I'm the square root of square. That, and I'd probably get some funny looks on Capitol Hill. My job doesn't allow me a lot of variety in fashion choices.

Pretty hair, Cash.

t puts "make my hair all merlot-colored again" higher on the list of "things to do as I start getting The Money"

Speaking of The Money and the spending thereof, I bought two adequate bras at LB. Apparently I'm a 40DDD for now. Yowza. Guess my rib cage did expand, since I spent my pre-baby adult life between 36D and 36DDD. Though the sales clerk who measured me came up with 40DD, and was miffed to be wrong. Hey, I tried the DD's, and they gave me quad-boobs.

I also wandered into a bookstore, because it was THERE. I bought Annabel Is Your Mama a Llama? and myself the new Jo Beverley, A Most Unsuitable Man: [link] Is that a yummy cover or what? Give the cover model chestnut hair instead of blond, and he'd be perfect for my wip's hero.

Susan has a new tag.

I don't know if this is an offensive question or not, and I really really really hope it isn't; if I do offend, please accept my apologies.

OK, my question: if the official doctrine of the Catholic Church as put forth by the current Pope makes a person want to cry, why not join another church? My (admittedly limited) understanding of Episcopalianism is that it's very similar to Catholicism in belief about Jesus Christ and the Apostles and Mary and the saints and everything, but with more liberal social policies in some parishes. What is it about Catholicism that is so different from, say, Episcopalianism, that it's worthwhile to stick around while the current Pope makes a mockery of the Word? What does a person get from Catholicism that a person wouldn't get from another institution?

I really hope this isn't an offensive question. It's just something that's mystified me for a while; I can't wrap my mind around pro-choice Catholics or gay Catholics. If the Church thinks you're evil for believing what you do or having sex with who you do, why not find a church that doesn't shit on you?

Huh. I guess I always just called them "Father (Firstname)". But then, if I'd known one of them before he was a priest, I probably wouldn't call him anything other than his first name.

One of my coworkers used to be a priest, and when we were talking about this the other day (go hivemind!) he said that he ususally got called Father Lastname, or actually Father Nickname, but he didn't care for Father Firstname.

I really hope this isn't an offensive question. It's just something that's mystified me for a while; I can't wrap my mind around pro-choice Catholics or gay Catholics. If the Church thinks you're evil for believing what you do or having sex with who you do, why not find a church that doesn't shit on you?

It isn't. As for why I remain Catholic, my primary interaction is with my local parish, which happens to be less dogmatic than Rome would like. The American Catholic Church has butted heads with JPII on a number of issues. I stay because it's part of who I am. I can't change things from outside the church doors.

Edit: This article is does a good job of explaining my perspective. [link]

Jen, no, it's not offensive (to me, anyway; YOMV). It's something I struggle with a lot. My understanding of the Episcopal church, which is admittedly paltry, is that they're more doctrinally ehn-maybe-this-is-literally-true-and-maybe-it's-just-a-beautiful-myth about some things that I actually do believe to be literally true (off the top of my head, transubstantiation and the Resurrection, but I think there may be more). And those beliefs are deep in me, and my participation in those rituals and remembrances and reenactments steadies me and keeps me rooted and I can't quite imagine being apart from that.

And part of it is that, dammit, I do believe I'm right and they're wrong, and I feel like if I leave I'm letting them define it; as long as I'm there, present and supporting my active and deeply community-rooted parish, the current Pope's truth about the Church isn't the entire truth.

Then there's the distance of Rome; the faith my mom taught me was always community-rooted. I love my parish; it's a cash-poor, struggling creature, but it's alive, it's active in the community.

Many of its members are activists not only because they march on the School of the Americas and are best buds with Martin Sheen and the Berrigans, but because they're feeding the hungry and clothing the naked of Berkeley year-round; standing at the gates of San Quentin at midnight on execution nights, praying for the murderer and the murdered and the survivors; walking local picket lines with grocery store clerks and the housekeeping staff at the Claremont Hotel; driving into skeevy neighborhoods on Thanksgiving and Christmas Eve to drop off goodie baskets; reading to the elderly, sitting by people's hospital beds, hosting AA and NA and AlAnon meetings; hosting venting sessions and forgiveness and reconciliation ceremonies for clerical abuse survivors.

They're such good people, and to me they are so much more the face of my faith than that old man in Rome could ever be. And I disagree fiercely with his stance on a woman's place in the world, on the value of her health and her sanity weighed against the fragile possible life in her womb, on birth control, condom use, and probably fifty other things, and I know what harm the Church's policies have done all over the world. And yet the people I actually know are doing concrete good here where I live, and bucking the establishment where they can (the pastor who blew his career by officially opposing Humana Vitae, the staff who stubbornly insist on using gender-inclusive language, the priest who sat in his study with me after my abortion and talked not about what a sinner I was, but about the difficulty of weighing a variety of bad choices in a deeply flawed world).

I love these people. They are Christ to me. I loathe much of what Rome does and I struggle with it constantly, but I can't imagine turning my back on this community.

t /Rambly McBabblePants

Thanks for that link. It's a really interesting read.

Are Catholics still supposed to believe in the infallibility of the Pope?

Edit: JZ, you ramble so beautifully. Thank you for your answer; it's very helpful to me in understanding. I guess it's sort of how I feel about the United States--I hate what it's become, but leaving feels like abandoning someone I love to a pack of wild jackals.

Are Catholics still supposed to believe in the infallibility of the Pope?

IIRC, he's infallible only when speaking ex cathedra, a very particular and rare circumstance. There've only been two ex cathedra Papal pronouncements in the last century-plus. When he's just, like, talking, he's like any other priest, but with a fancier hat.