What I don't understand is the personal rage and sense of betrayal that I've seen exhibited in some responses. Good stories hurt. That's what they do. Good stories surprise and challenge. Killing Wash off was a narrative choice inherent to the form,

Good stories CAN hurt, and there are books I re-read or movies I re-watch where characters I love die. I get upset and sniffly each time, but those deaths don't change how I feel about that book or movie. Don't ask me why Wash's death makes Serenity different for me, why it changes my reaction to the movie, because I can't really explain it myself; it's something very far back in my hindbrain. When I think about it objectively, the narrative choice of killing Wash makes perfect sense. But something about it rubs my emotions the wrong way. I'm sure I'll get to a point where I will watch Serenity again, but right now? No.

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Well, Joss did say that he would be able to have Wash and Book in any sequel, so he wouldn't have to go down the prequel route.

I'm with Consuela, in that I also don't get some of the reactions to Wash's death, but hey, each to their own. For me, it worked a treat, as I did wonder at that point if the trilogy talk was a complete smokescreen, and everyone was going to die. The friend I took (who I had lent the DVDs to) said that it happened just as he was thinking how unreasonable it was that everyone had survived the space-chase. So it worked for him too.

Er, that's all I got.

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I'm afraid I don't understand why people are announcing that they'll never watch the sequel, will "never trust Joss again", and that sort of thing.

I think I'm the person who brought up trust. It wasn't brought up in that context at all, Consuela. It was brought up to explain why I spoiled for BtVS. My trust faded out somewhere between the time of Dawn's appearance, and when Cordelia turned into a demon. The loss of trust has nothing to do with anything that ever happened on Firefly. It predates Firefly. It has to do with how characters are handled/portrayed, much more than anything to do with their actual fates. Some of my favorite M.E. moments are the heartbreakers, including the deaths.

As for a Serenity sequel, it's sort of like this...

River always annoyed me a little. I don't get Simon. Although I thought she was cute, I always found Kaylee to be more caricature than developed character. The holes in the Companion mythology are such that Inara never quite worked for me. I loved Mal, Zoe, Jayne, Book, and Wash, and [Zoe + Wash]. With Wash, Book, and [Zoe + Wash] gone, and with River the main event, I doubt there's enough in the 'verse to hold my interest. It's not a You-Killed-Character-X-I-Hate-You-You-Bastard feeling. It's a Oh-Never-Mind-that-bores-me feeling.

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Flight Plan is on half again as many screens and made half again as much money.

???

Serenity has a higher per screen average than Flightplan but it should since this was the 2nd week of Flightplan.

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I think I'm the person who brought up trust. It wasn't brought up in that context at all, Consuela.

I've seen it elsewhere, Cindy -- I wasn't making a point of your commentary so much as the absolute outrage at killing Wash. As if people felt that Joss did it to be mean to them, personally, as if it had no other value.

I don't mean to put anyone on the spot here at B.org: it's a response I'm seeing in a number of places, and I'm just having trouble parsing it. As my friend Laura said, we're not necessarily talking about bad writing (like parts of late Buffy): it's the fact of the death that has people worked up. I dunno. ::shrugs::

Allyson, I don't think it's outrageous to trust a professional storyteller to tell a story. That's what I trust Joss to do. He's not perfect, but neither is anyone else out there writing television or movies. I don't trust him to save the world or pay my mortgage or come by to feed my dog when I'm out of town. I do trust him to make an effort to entertain me and challenge me (even if it doesn't altogether work); on that basis I'm good with what he's done to date, and will continue to watch what he produces.

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Allyson, I don't think it's outrageous to trust a professional storyteller to tell a story.

The context of my answer was about not killing off a beloved character and breaking your heart.

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My sister had a reaction kind of similar to Jilli's - she's not arguing that it wasn't a good narrative choice, but that Wash's death really affected her ability to enjoy the movie as a whole. Some things just hit in a really emotional place that can't be reasoned with.

Um, not that she didn't sit next to me for a second time on Friday squealing and jumping and gasping all along.

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I got back 2 hours ago from the movie, which I liked quite a lot. I laughed, I almost cried when the dinosaurs on the console were panned, and cringed at the violence. (Although not the River's balletic kick-ass violence because the gracefullness was wonderful to me.) I was more irked by Mal's "you're only my crew if I say so", because it seems SO contrary to earlier sentiments, than I was the River escape retcon. Much of the other changes I chalked up to time passing, but for some reason the crew thing really bothered me. I hadn't necessarily connected Book & the Operative as possibly having similar careers. It makes sense, although I wouldn't mind having visual confirmation of that.

I think I'm sometimes easy to please in terms of movies, although I do have to be in the right mindframe. This worked well for me. It got my adrenaline pumping, and violence was tempered by humor. And that dress! I don't think I've ever seen anyone wear a dress quite so well.

eta: dinosaurs in this instance are plural, and not possessive.

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I was more irked by Mal's "you're only my crew if I say so", because it seems SO contrary to earlier sentiments, than I was the River escape retcon.

That was definitely the hardest bit for me to swallow.

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I liked the movie quite a lot. I was expecting it to be somewhat different from the show, and I was happily willing to make the trade. Not even a trade, really. I still have the show. I think it did make me re-mourn for the seasons of TV I wish I'd had, but that didn't detract from the movie for me.

I thought Summer Glau was terrific, and I was emotionally engaged in what was going on with her. I thought the hologram reveal was really well done.

I was oddly pained at seeng Serenity dressed up as a reaver ship, and I was really surprised by how hard it was to watch the ship get torn up during the crash landing. I knew I liked the ship, but I hadn't realized how much I'd bought in to Serenity as the tenth charachter. Go figure.

Wash and Book. Heartbreaking. Book's death served the plot more, and Wash's was more for the gut-punch, but both of them worked for me. I would totally go back and push Wash out of the way if I could, though. But I've felt that way before about characters, and I think that's a testament to the creators of a character - writer, director and actor if it's not a book.

Thought NF did a great job, too. He delivers the angry and the funny well.

I probably have nitpicks, but, eh, I really enjoyed it overall.

Though, OK, I did go back Saturday specifically to focus on Wash and be able to watch the rest after he died without the gut-punch effect. Hmmm. So, while the killing of Wash isn't a problem for me narratively, the execution of it was a little too shocking for me to regain my equilibrium to watch the rest of the story fully engaged the first time. I don't really know that killing him another way would have kept me fully in the movie, though. Then again, it did ensure that I'd go again on Saturday, so...

Also, I thought the ship looked cool.

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