Isn't it possible that what appear as species attributes are really cultural ones? That centaurs don't have high-handedness somehow written into their genes but as a cultural trait? We don't really ever see any of these non-human groups in isolation from their species.
No, it's shiny! I like to meet new people. They've all got stories...
Kaylee ,'Serenity'
The Buffista Book Club: the Harry Potter iteration
This thread is a focused discussion group. Please see the first post below for the current topic and upcoming book discussions. While natter will inevitably happen, we encourage you to treat this like a virtual book club and try to keep your posts in that spirit.
By consensus, this thread is reopened specifically to discuss Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows. It will be closed again once that discussion has run its course.
***SPOILER ALERT***
Emily - Oct 25, 2007 4:39:40 am PDT #3276 of 3301
"In the equation E = mc⬧, c⬧ is a pretty big honking number." - Scola
Aims - Oct 25, 2007 5:13:47 am PDT #3277 of 3301
Shit's all sorts of different now.
I can't see how either species can avoid being read as ethnic groups by a large portion of readers.
Then I would think that has more to do with the individual reader than how the author presented it. Like ita and Hil, I never read the books and thought, "Oh nice. The Goblins are obviously supposed to represent Jews." I mean, I can *see* how it can be read like that now, but I needed it pointed out to me.
I'm sure JKR did not intend it, but it does not mean it won't be there for many.
But is that JKR's responsibility in the end? Or any author's for that matter? Are authors responsible for how their readers will take something in their story? Should authors read through their texts and edit themselves because some readers might take issue with how a fantastical species/race of being is being portrayed and what parallels some readers draw from it?
(And I'm not asking this specifically of you, Typo. Just wondering out loud.)
Vortex - Oct 25, 2007 5:47:10 am PDT #3278 of 3301
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman
well, it's kind of like the memfault!trade aliens in Phantom Menace. Lucas said that he did not intend for them to be seen as Asian, but pretty much everyone saw it.
Aims - Oct 25, 2007 5:50:15 am PDT #3279 of 3301
Shit's all sorts of different now.
Ok, but how much of that is Lucas's responsibility? How can he account for what people are going to infer?
Vortex - Oct 25, 2007 5:51:17 am PDT #3280 of 3301
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman
Yes, that's what I was saying. Although, personally, I would have been hard pressed NOT to see it. I believe that he didn't intend it, but I think that he was in some denial.
Aims - Oct 25, 2007 5:52:40 am PDT #3281 of 3301
Shit's all sorts of different now.
AH!
I need more coffee.
(See - my default is noone agress with me so I inferred you were saying I was FOS. Hee.)
Jessica - Oct 25, 2007 6:12:52 am PDT #3282 of 3301
If I want to become a cloud of bats, does each bat need a separate vaccination?
Intentional or not, Lucas managed to create several fictional alien species in TPM who were basically just laundry lists of racist sterotypes. (Jar-Jar, the Not!Asians, the Not!Jew who owned Anakin & his mother, and so on.)
I'm not saying he has a responsibility to not be an ignorant dumbass, but it sure wouldn't hurt.
JKR's species have enough depth to give her plausible deniability, at the very least.
Vortex - Oct 25, 2007 6:28:40 am PDT #3283 of 3301
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman
Intentional or not, Lucas managed to create several fictional alien species in TPM who were basically just laundry lists of racist sterotypes. (Jar-Jar, the Not!Asians, the Not!Jew who owned Anakin & his mother, and so on.)
I'm not saying he has a responsibility to not be an ignorant dumbass, but it sure wouldn't hurt.
ITA. I used Lucas as an example becuase I thought that the plausibility line was veeerry blurry.
Aims - Oct 25, 2007 6:33:40 am PDT #3284 of 3301
Shit's all sorts of different now.
ITA, also.
Trudy Booth - Oct 25, 2007 6:36:15 am PDT #3285 of 3301
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart
well, it's kind of like the memfault!trade aliens in Phantom Menace. Lucas said that he did not intend for them to be seen as Asian, but pretty much everyone saw it.
Didn't they have almond eyes?
I mean, its not a big reach to say "those guys are Asian" when they have almond eyes.
To say that big nosed characters are Jewish is application of a stereotype, but to say that almond-eyed characters are Asian is more actually descriptive.
JKR's species have enough depth to give her plausible deniability, at the very least.
Not only that, she has a racial analogy with the mud blood thing and the Wizards attitudes towards Muggles.