While I was shedding a tear or two (or three) during the scene with Wes and not!Fred, I admired the exquisite lie-within-a-lie Illyria was telling Wes: Not only did Illyria appear to Wes as Fred, but she comforted him with the notion that soon Wes and Fred would be together again. But Fred's soul was destroyed when Illyria stole her body---

(edited to add the "the" I left out earlier.)

Not only did Illyria appear to Wes as Fred, but she comforted him with notion that soon Wes and Fred would be together again. But Fred's soul was destroyed when Illyria stole her body---

I have to WAHHH!! again at that.

Catching up this morning brought the allergies back on, I was a mess last night. Thank goodness my DH is as bad as I am, so we cried together.

Random thoughts:

Standing with deb in the they-survived-there-will-be-a-movie corner at least until the finality starts sinking into my brain.

I definitely thought that Lorne was acting under Angel's orders. I also like the idea (though it didn't occur to me till I read it here) that he has known for some time that this was coming, and he was not looking forward to it. That will, for me, explain his odd detachment lately. I was sad that he killed Lindsey, but understood it. That whole Angel/Lindsey scene was great. "You do get a little speechy you know..."

The only thing that bothered me really was Harmony's betrayal. While I completely agree that it was in character, and made sense, I was really hoping she would somehow end up on the good side.

I didn't love Connor when he was whiny!Connor, but I definitely loved him this season.

It was great that Gunn saw Anne for a moment, I liked her little thread running between the two shows. So funny how many years apart her appearances were.

I have nothing else coherent to add at the moment, but let me chime in with saying that I can't tell you all how much you have added to my enjoyment of the shows, and how much I have appreciated your brain stimulating conversation! Though I suspect it has been somewhat detrimental to my work life, it has enriched the world in my brain more than you can imagine.

I still cannot form coherent thoughts. Last night broke me. Angel wanting Lindsey made me laugh, Wesley made me cry, Illyria scoping on Gunn made me smile, Angel wanting to take on the dragon was perfect.

Then the fucking WB. Thank YOU so fucking much. Le sigh.

Hey, the grey hats on Angel don't really use guns, do they?

Hey, the grey hats on Angel don't really use guns, do they?

So I guess Lorne was a...turquoise hat? Cranberry, perhaps?

Angel killed Drogon. ::gulp::

But they're heroes - their lives are always in danger, and they could always die in the next fifteen minutes. Just because we see their killers before the credits roll doesn't make it any different.

Yes yes yes!

The ending had me all Princess Bridey minded. And then they mentioned Wesley and I got all sad. sighhh

Angel totally had Lindsey wacked. L feeling all betrayed that a flunkie did it instead of the man himself was like that episode of the Sopranos with the scorned psycho lover who Tony had warned. Awesome.

And Wesley dying in 'Fred's' lap teared up more than a few of us.

Jess, thank you! I thought of Willow's line, too. And it's not just romantic vs. parental love, I think; it's the epiphany that moments count.

Angel was coming down a set of stairs when he went in, so maybe it was on a basement level.

My friend Jessie was the quintessential New Yorker, dressed in black, abhorred sunlight, and went to college at Stanford. When I visited her there, I learned that she'd discovered the one cafe/pool thingie/student club/whatever-it-was in all of Palo Alto that was partially underground, either windowless or had obscured windows, and was very underlit. Even during noon.

Angel just stashed the umbrella and raincoat outside because he wanted to lurk a bit before Connor noticed him.

Just checking in. I was sucked in to the episode, cried at Wes' death, didn't roll my eyes at plot points or meta dialogue (which I have been known to do this season). Just really great execution of a really great kick-ass episode.

During the killing of the Black Thorns scenes, I yelled, "That's totally The Godfather! The montage of murder at the end of The Godfather!" Sadly, Tom has never seen The Godfather, so he couldn't back me up (or disagree).

When it was over, and the credits flashed, I lost it. I was so overwhelmed, and the ending was like... stopping in the middle of a rollercoaster ride, sudden and sickening. So I cried quite a bit then. NSM during the episode (except for Wesley's death).

I wanted to thank you people who pointed out all the ways the presence of Anne worked in the episode (a bunch of people mentioned this, but I've forgotten whom): it evokes the early seasons of the show, and she restates Angel's epiphany to Gunn, and Gunn gets back to his roots: character development and mission statement simultaneously, a lovely bit of work.

But I also like it because whenever I see Anne, I remember that she's named after Buffy, and that who she is now is very significantly modelled after Buffy. Anne always modeled herself after the strongest figure to come along; Buffy was the first one who told her she had to be strong for herself. So Anne was, and she also learned how to protect others, following Buffy's example.

And this is -- for me, who loves Buffy-the-character so dearly -- a wonderful and subtle way to deal with her influence in the finale. She's not there because it's not her show; her influence is there, because Anne wouldn't be there without her, and neither would Angel or Spike; and none of the rest of them would be there without Angel. And this is one of the things I love best about the Jossverse, which is that the good characters do lives on after them and has effects and influences far beyond their intentions or realizations. That the heroism or compassion or courage or grace people exhibit in casual ways are so empowering to others. Because what made Buffy a hero to Anne was not just her strength and her quick way with an axe, but her willingness to be drawn into fighting to protect others, despite her initial resistance.

And it's a lovely bit of synchronicity both that "Anne" takes place in LA, and that Buffy in "Anne" was the most like the pre-Buffy Angel AtS eventually developed: hurt, withdrawn, self-hating, brooding -- and drawn out by the necessity for heroism, despite herself.

It's a very minor element of "Not Fade Away," but I like it very much.