But I understand. You gave up everything you had to find me. And you found me broken. It's hard for you.

River ,'Safe'


LotR - The Return of the King: "We named the *dog* 'Strider'".  

Frodo: Please, what does it always mean, this... this "Aragorn"? Elrond: That's his name. Aragorn, son of Arathorn. Aragorn: I like "Strider." Elrond: We named the *dog* "Strider".

A discussion of Lord of the Rings - The Return of the King. If you're a pervy hobbit fancier, this is the place for you.


Kate P. - Dec 17, 2003 10:03:37 am PST #63 of 3902
That's the pain / That cuts a straight line down through the heart / We call it love

I love the Gondor theme. Not quite as much as the Rohan theme, but probably about as much as the Fellowship theme. And "Into the West" is just perfect. "Safe in my arms, you're only sleeping..." *sob*

I liked Arwen showing up at the end, which was good, because I wanted to want her to be there, you know? It did bug me a bit that she looked so young. I always liked the idea that she is so much older than Aragorn, and yet can't help falling in love with him when she sees the man he has become. I liked her turning back because of her son. However, the whole "Arwen's fate is now tied to the fate of the Ring"--what? Excuse me? Makes no sense at all, and I didn't think it added anything to the story. Was it supposed to give Aragorn some added incentive to win the war? Because, hello, weight of the world already upon his shoulders. I did like that Elrond was crying, though. I thought Hugo Weaving was excellent in ROTK, after finding him too campy and creepy in TTT.


§ ita § - Dec 17, 2003 10:07:08 am PST #64 of 3902
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Elrond was totally cute.

Which I didn't expect.


Beverly - Dec 17, 2003 10:11:05 am PST #65 of 3902
Days shrink and grow cold, sunlight through leaves is my song. Winter is long.

Aside from these actors, who are Just the Best Ever?

I think I'm in love with Fran Walsh and Philipa Boyens, for the words. The ones they lifted from Tolkein they chose well, and the ones they paraphrased? Also good.


tina f. - Dec 17, 2003 10:20:38 am PST #66 of 3902

Just the Best Ever besides the actors?

Richard Taylor. He is the bomb dot com.

It was all too much to take in - with the crying and the having chills that lasted like 5 minutes straight (Hugest chill moments: first time we get a full bottom to top view of Minas Tirith and the when we see the first full assemblage of the Riders and all those freaking horses). I couldn't focus like I wanted to on the swords, the saddles, the clothes, and the various WETA-ness of it all.


Maytree - Dec 17, 2003 10:23:59 am PST #67 of 3902
I try to love my neighbor as myself. Unfortunately, I have a lot of self-loathing.

Overall I loved it, including the writing, but there were two places where I wished they had gone with Tolkien rather than colloquializing the speech:

First, the exchange between Eowyn and the WitchKing: I've always loved, "Fool! No living man may slay the Nazgul!" "No living man am I! There stands before you a woman!" -- the colloquial "I am no man!" just didn't cut it for me.

Second, Frodo at the Cracks: Another well-beloved line is the "I have come. But I do not choose now to do what I came to do." I loved the matter-of-factness of it. "Yep, struggled all that way, got here...changed my mind. Sorry, Sammy!" -- this all got shortened to "The Ring is Mine!" and Elijah looking all evil and possessed (which he did really well, don't get me wrong, but I wanted the Tolkien "changed my mind" line in there.)

Right now I'm trying to decide if I should keep packing or go see the movie...my precioussss....again. Must. Keep. Filling. Boxes....

Edited because it's been so long since I've posted I've forgotten how the ding-dang spoiler tags work.


§ ita § - Dec 17, 2003 10:28:03 am PST #68 of 3902
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Minas Tirith looked just right. Tolkien didn't give me many clear pictures, but Minas Tirith has been in my head for a few years, and PJ's people did a good copy of it.


Sean K - Dec 17, 2003 10:32:36 am PST #69 of 3902
You can't leave me to my own devices; my devices are Nap and Eat. -Zenkitty

Maytree, re: the first part of your white font...

I wanted to hear the whole thing:

"Begone, foul dwimmerlaik, Lord of Carrion, leave the dead in peace."

"Come not between the Nazgul and his prey, or he will not slay thee in they turn, but bear thee away to the Houses of Lamentation, where thy flesh shall be devoured and thy shrivelled mind be left naked before the Lidless Eye."

"Do what you will, but I will hinder it, if I can."

"Thou fool. No living man may hinder me."

"But no living man am I. You look upon a woman. Eowyn, Eomund's daughter. You stand between me and my lord and kin. Begone, if you be not deathless, for living or dark undead, I will smite you if you touch him."

I was a tad upset that they trunkated one of the greatest dialog exchanges ever written, but again, PJ did so much right, I can live with it.

(And yes, I may have gotten parts of it wrong, but I pulled that exchange from memory.)


tina f. - Dec 17, 2003 10:34:29 am PST #70 of 3902

Having seen the documentaries on the miniatures where you see Minas Tirith, I thought I had a pretty good idea of what to expect - but it just took my breath away. From the camera coming up over the ridge from the bottom and just going up and up and up. Then to Gandalf riding through the streets the whole sequence was better and so much more realistic than I could have imagined.

Another thing I thought I was prepared for was the landscape. How much more beautiful could NZ look than in FotR? Once you've seen one snow capped mountain range, you've seen em all - right? Uhm. Wrong.

Unexpected sobbing moment? Sure, I cried at the reunion scene - but the harder Gandalf laughed, the harder I cried.

I *know* I was getting looks. And I don't care. Stoopid lame crowd.


Maytree - Dec 17, 2003 10:37:55 am PST #71 of 3902
I try to love my neighbor as myself. Unfortunately, I have a lot of self-loathing.

Sean, I wanted the whole thing too, but I knew that wasn't going to happen. I just didn't realize how thoroughly truncated the dialog in question was going to be.

As you say, it's one of those "Hey, if that's the worst I can come up with to complain about, life's pretty good," things. I think on balance PJ and the crew added more stuff I liked than left out stuff I wanted, so I feel a bit ungrateful grumbling...but still. Must. Pick. Nits. (More. Fun. Than. Packing!)


Kate P. - Dec 17, 2003 10:45:19 am PST #72 of 3902
That's the pain / That cuts a straight line down through the heart / We call it love

Yeah, tina, there were definitely moments when I actually gasped at the scenery. That was one of the joys of seeing FOTR and TTT on the big screen again, remembering just how incredible those mountains and valleys are. Gah. Oh, and Gandalf and Pippin riding through Minas Tirith took my breath away too.