Yeah, my point exactly--I don't know why I was surprised that I didn't recognize him. (He's 60? Making him 38 in BR? I guess I thought he was younger.)

Yeah, my point exactly--I don't know why I was surprised that I didn't recognize him. (He's 60? Making him 38 in BR? I guess I thought he was younger.)

23 Jan 44 says imdb. I've always thought of him as a fairly big guy, definitely not a skinny hollywood male type. It looks like he's been getting consistent work, but in generally low-profile B stuff. Too bad, I've always thought he was great.

I'm pondering zeitgest-y things (on TV, pop culture).

90s: beginning with Twin Peaks and Silence of the Lambs you have the FBI-in-black, and forensic autopsies are cool. Which roll out in waves through X-Files, Men in Black, CSI and innumerable knock-offs. Also, you see a lot of Riot Grrrll protagonists (Wm. Gibson, Neal Stephenson).

00s: Theme is...Talking to Dead People; Sixth Sense, Six Feet Under, The Lovely Bones, Wonderfalls/Tru Calling/Joan of Arcadia, "Conversations With Dead People." You see a lot of either damaged waif protagonists or snarky neo-goth girls (dating back to the ur-progenitor of this type, Darlene Connor. Reflected in Daria/Jane, Mandy on Grim & Evil, Raven on Teen Titans, and many other cartoons).

Also, you see a lot of Riot Grrrll protagonists (Wm. Gibson, Neal Stephenson).

David, I regret to inform you that neither Neal Stephenson nor Wm. Gibson is a grrl, much less a riotous one. Do you mean by "riot grrl" the Buffy/Xena type, or do you mean like Lori Petty in Tank Girl (which is my meaning, and the only one I can think of), or both?

I'm not sure I see the Oughties cohering as much as you do. Partly because I've never heard of most of the cartoons you cite above, and partly because my general sense is that fandom, as an advance scout of pop culture, is floundering around with no idea what the Next Big Thing is.

The new TV schedule? People I know are watching practically everything, trying to find something to latch on to unreservedly. Movies? Well, too soon to tell, and really, if there was a theme for the last 6 months it was "We had one good idea, and now we have flogged it to death in the sequel!"

Can we make a theme out of Samurai Jack, a zombie/disease anxiety movie and novels about superheroes? Actually, there have been lots of works about superheroes recently, both in comics (duh) and movies, and in novels too.

David, I regret to inform you that neither Neal Stephenson nor Wm. Gibson is a grrl, much less a riotous one. Do you mean by "riot grrl" the Buffy/Xena type, or do you mean like Lori Petty in Tank Girl (which is my meaning, and the only one I can think of), or both?

I think he means Riot Grrl in the K Records/Kill Rock Stars/Plei's annoying ex roomies type.

And Neal did have some Riot Grrlish chicas in Snow Crash.

Um, he had one. Who was incredibly icky. (I have Neal Stephenson hatred.)

I guess riot grrls never really made it to my neck of the woods? Or perhaps they were a primarily music-based phenomenon; I remember the names of bands like 7 Year Bitch, but I'm generally clueless about the music scene. I can't come up with a visual riot grrl image except for Tank Girl.

I do remember the Lesbian Avengers, though! They wore gorilla masks and did funny/obnoxious things.

And Neal did have some Riot Grrlish chicas in Snow Crash.

Also had some pseudo Riot Grrls in Cryptonomicon, and Diamond Age was primarily about a hyper-personalized book to craft a Riot Grrrl.

But again, we all may be using slightly different definitions of Riot Grrrl.

I guess riot grrls never really made it to my neck of the woods? Or perhaps they were a primarily music-based phenomenon; I remember the names of bands like 7 Year Bitch, but I'm generally clueless about the music scene. I can't come up with a visual riot grrl image except for Tank Girl.

Hmm.

What year did you start college?

The grrls sort of faded from view in my neck of the woods (sort of) by '94 (it's slightly more complex than that, but I didn't see a huge swell of new grrls after '93). It was more than music and vegan bakesales.

Cereal:

I think Riot Grrrl is one of those terms that conjures up a slightly different image for everybody.

I definitely see Lori Petty's Tank Girl as a Riot Grrrl, but not Buffy - Buffy wanted to conform or be popular, even though she knew it would never happen. My image of Riot Grrrls is heavy on the not wanting to conform.

(And out of curiousity, Nutty: Why the Neal Stephenson hate?)

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