Consuela's questions

sometimes

maybe

t /not helpful

I would offer that stories of happyland and a board filled with all goodwill are really just not accurate. It seems that everyone feels that way about the board when they first became active, and the gradually and sometimes not so gradually they see faults and then we all eventually enter the realm of cycles of cranky and grumpy.

The center could stand to keep the wishes of the edges in mind. We're intelligent people and, historically, compassionate ones.

But making the people at one edge happy makes people in the middle moderately unhappy, and people at the other edge REALLY unhappy. Ideally, a decision made in the center only makes the edges moderately unhappy. If you know you're on the edge of popular opinion, you have to know that most things won't go your way most of the time.

I am a bit sad that almost no one responded to his (or Hec's or Trudy's) posts by saying "IS there?" "Am I possibly making people feel disenfranchised?"

Scrappy, thanks for raising that point. I hope we all have a bit of the "Is it me?" thing in our hearts -- I know I do. The problem is, it's a hard thing to publically discuss. It's the cyber equivalent of "Do I look fat in these pants?"; the right answer is always no. (Okay, unless you're in a dressing room and debating between two sizes, one of which is smaller than you normally wear, and not fat in the least in any case, but let's not parse the metaphor.)

And maybe a conscious effort to return to the congenieal roots of the board - the openness and tollerance I heard so much about for so long - might not be a bad idea

Rafmun, this sounds like a good idea. I'll admit that I feel the board is about as harsh now as it was in 2001, when I started posting. But trying for tolerance is never a bad thing.

Steph, everyone gets a say, but not everyone's say gets the same weight in everyone's head.

But the board I heard so many good things about featured posters considering other posters' points, extending true consideration to ideas - whatever the source, newbie or veteran.

I also don't appreciate the implication that there is little to no consideration of others, or politeness, in the current board culture.

Rafmun, it's these assertions that bother me, that I disagree with completely, and that you are just throwing out there and insisting we take at face value.

I'm interested in what you have to say, and engaging you in discussion, but it really seems to me as if you're descending deeper into hyperbole with every post.

Okay, I guess I can't let things die. But when I posted essentially the same thing -- though in a much more aggressive tone -- people stepped up and said "Nope; everyone gets a say." How is what I said so different?

Both points effectively ignore the issues raised by said newbie and instead focus on the cred. It's a fantastic way to undermine a posters' value and avoid dealing with uncomfortable issues, and a really horrible way to encourage insight and input from new sources.

the cyber equivalent of "Do I look fat in these pants?"

"Do I look fat in this font?"

Rafmun, do you think we are ignoring the issues you are raising?

Ideally, a decision made in the center only makes the edges moderately unhappy. If you know you're on the edge of popular opinion, you have to know that most things won't go your way most of the time.

What Jesse said.

I feel like we already do a lot to bow to the most sensitive posters on things like spoilers and thread proliferation. But to agree with Trudy -- it is important that we keep in mind that sometimes, the extreme desires of a few are more important than the slight desires of many.

And Scrappy's point is fair*, I should have asked "is it me?" rather than just automatically taking up the "there is no problem" banner.

(*tangent - Do you have any idea how hard it is to stop calling you Scrappy?)