Occasionally I'm callous and strange.

Willow ,'The Killer In Me'


Boxed Set, Vol. VI: I am not a number, I am a free thread!

A topic for the discussion of Doctor Who, Arrow, and The Flash. Beware possible invasions of iZombie, Sleepy Hollow, or pretty much any other "genre" (read: sci fi, superhero, or fantasy) show that captures our fancy. Expect adult content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.

Marvel superheroes are discussed over at the MCU thread.

Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.

Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.

This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.


Tom Scola - Nov 20, 2018 8:19:09 am PST #1185 of 2020
Mr. Scola’s wardrobe by Botany 500

I need to go back and watch LOT. What's a good jumping on point? When did it start to not suck?


sj - Nov 20, 2018 8:41:52 am PST #1186 of 2020
"There are few hours in life more agreeable than the hour dedicated to the ceremony known as afternoon tea."

Last season was very good, but this season is consistently charming.


Toddson - Nov 20, 2018 8:51:56 am PST #1187 of 2020
Friends don't let friends read "Atlas Shrugged"

I missed most of last season, so I'm out of the loop for a lot of what went on; however, with this new season, they seem to be having fun with a number of tropes.


Dana - Nov 20, 2018 12:37:49 pm PST #1188 of 2020
"I'm useless alone." // "We're all useless alone. It's a good thing you're not alone."

What's a good jumping on point? When did it start to not suck?

Season 2.


-t - Nov 20, 2018 1:13:31 pm PST #1189 of 2020
I am a woman of various inclinations and only some of the time are they to burn everything down in frustration

I think I stopped watching some time in season 1 and felt like I should figure out exactly where and pick up where I left off, but maybe I'll just jump to season 2...


Steph L. - Nov 20, 2018 1:17:07 pm PST #1190 of 2020
Unusually and exceedingly peculiar and altogether quite impossible to describe

Yeah, I stopped in S1 because I couldn't stand whatshisname, the dude who was also on Doctor Who. Arthur something? Maybe? The dude in charge. He was so awful I gave up. (I hear he's gone, but I never went back to check it out.)


billytea - Nov 20, 2018 1:32:54 pm PST #1191 of 2020
You were a wrong baby who grew up wrong. The wrong kind of wrong. It's better you hear it from a friend.

Oh dear God I just watched the latest Doctor Who and BUBBLE WRAP! It's Doctor Who and the big threat is BUBBLE WRAP! It's a payoff to a relationship stretching back 43 years, pretty much as long as bubble wrap has existed within the public consciousness. Bubble wrap is the key to understanding a fundamental element of classic Doctor Who. (In other words, I thought that was just hilarious.)

For this one we're going back to one of the greatest of the classic adventures, The Ark in Space. (I give it 10/10.) Question: what really sets classic Who apart from the new series? Somewhere near the top of the list has to be that audience favourite - dodgy special effects. Wobbly sets, unconvincing models, glaringly obvious CSO, men in rubber suits. Exhibit A: gifs from the Third Doctor adventure, Invasion of the Dinosaurs: [link] My favourite scene is one where a T. rex and Brontosaurus apparently share a snuggle.

(In fact, it was never really that bad. It was produced on a shoestring and sometimes it showed, but the design team more often got away with it. Case in point: the design of the Daleks.)

Back to The Ark in Space. This was the first adventure from the production team of Hinchcliffe and Holmes, and announced that Doctor Who was now all about the horror. Ark in Space does a brilliant job of translating Alien for a family-friendly audience. Even more impressive in that it came out four years before Alien. (As far as I'm aware, there's no evidence that Dan O'Bannon or Ridley Scott had seen Ark in Space.)

Basic plot: a space station carrying the hibernating remnants of humanity is invaded by space wasp-like creatures who intend to lay their eggs in the sleeping humans like they were caterpillars. You can see the design of the creatures here: [link] Larvae on top, adults on the bottom. Oh, and here's a gif of one of the larvae in motion: [link]

They go straight for the body horror in episode 2, when the human leader ignores the Doctor's warning and gets himself bitten on the hand, and starts transforming into one of the space wasps. You can see a pic from the episode 1 cliffhanger here: [link] He's rather further gone by this stage: [link]

The point of linking these pics is: Noah's transformation (yes, they call the Ark's commander Noah) and the larvae were realised via a fairly new and interestingly textured packing material going by the name of bubble wrap. The crawling larva is a stuntman wriggling along the floor in a roll of bubble wrap. Noah's arm? Wrap it up in bubble wrap and spray paint it green. In space, no one can hear you go poppoppoppop!

(It really did go poppoppoppop. They couldn't record sound for the crawling stuntman larva because of the bubble-popping cacophany.)


billytea - Nov 20, 2018 1:32:54 pm PST #1192 of 2020
You were a wrong baby who grew up wrong. The wrong kind of wrong. It's better you hear it from a friend.

For a modern audience, of course, it's pretty obvious that Noah's just got his hand stuck in bubble wrap. Less so at the time, as it wasn't widespread yet. Interesting exercise to graph the term's frequency over time: [link] Still, today it's clear it was done on the cheap. But Kenton Moore (playing Noah) goes for it, trying his best to convey the horror of seeing yourself transforming into something monstrous. He's acting for a drama, not a kid's panto. Even if there's something absurd about being slowly encased in packing material, he's acting like the effects are as good as Alien.

And from this - and the point of this whole thing, really - comes a term familiar to many Doctor Who fans, that goes a long way to explaining why the classic series got away with it: believing the bubble wrap. If the actors take the dodgy effects seriously, then the audience will too. (Up to a point, I mean those dinosaurs.) When actors came on Doctor Who and started hamming it up like it was 'just for kids', that's when the spell's broken.

So anyway, that's why I found it hilarious that they weaponised bubble wrap. I'm pretty sure they knew just what they were doing too.

Edit: damn, that was supposed to be my short comment on Kerblam!. I have more to say about the ep itself.


askye - Nov 20, 2018 1:38:51 pm PST #1193 of 2020
Thrive to spite them

Legends of Tomorrow really wasnt great the first season . They kept writing themselves in corners then they realized it's time travel there are no corners!

And now it's the weird show that has giant stuffed blue toys that are worshipped as God and sometimes fight a demon and has unicorns and a pirate episode and a bunch of other wacky stuff and still occasionally makes me cry.

What's his name from doctor Who is in the second season but he gets less important.


Zenkitty - Nov 20, 2018 1:42:52 pm PST #1194 of 2020
Every now and then, I think I might actually be a little odd.

That's cool, billy tea, I didn't know any of that!

Believe the Bubble Wrap