You know, with the exception of one deadly and unpredictable midget, this girl is the smallest cargo I've ever had to transport. Yet by far the most troublesome. Does that seem right to you?

Early ,'Objects In Space'


Boxed Set, Vol. VI: I am not a number, I am a free thread!

A topic for the discussion of Doctor Who, Arrow, and The Flash. Beware possible invasions of iZombie, Sleepy Hollow, or pretty much any other "genre" (read: sci fi, superhero, or fantasy) show that captures our fancy. Expect adult content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.

Marvel superheroes are discussed over at the MCU thread.

Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.

Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.

This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.


Steph L. - Oct 04, 2018 11:57:03 am PDT #1040 of 2023
Unusually and exceedingly peculiar and altogether quite impossible to describe

Randomly: Damon Gupton, the actor who plays the police chief in Black Lightning is also a orchestral conductor. I only found this out because he's guest conducting our pops orchestra next weekend. Talk about a Renaissance man!


Jessica - Oct 06, 2018 6:21:49 am PDT #1041 of 2023
And then Ortus came and said "It's Ortin' time" and they all Orted off into the sunset

I wasn't sure if this should go here or in Literary, but they showed some clips and a trailer at the Good Omens panel just now, and it looks AMAZING. I was cautiously excited before, now I for real can't wait to see the whole thing.


Vortex - Oct 07, 2018 3:34:31 pm PDT #1042 of 2023
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman

No Who discussion? Or are we waiting until after the 'extended' episode tonight?


sj - Oct 07, 2018 3:37:47 pm PDT #1043 of 2023
"There are few hours in life more agreeable than the hour dedicated to the ceremony known as afternoon tea."

I just started watching now. I couldn't get to the TV any earlier.


sj - Oct 07, 2018 3:46:25 pm PDT #1044 of 2023
"There are few hours in life more agreeable than the hour dedicated to the ceremony known as afternoon tea."

A few minutes in and I love it!


billytea - Oct 07, 2018 3:59:36 pm PDT #1045 of 2023
You were a wrong baby who grew up wrong. The wrong kind of wrong. It's better you hear it from a friend.

No Who discussion? Or are we waiting until after the 'extended' episode tonight?

They'll be showing it here at 5:55. I'll only just be on the train home then! I have tasked Ryan with the great and awesome responsibility of recording it.


Jessica - Oct 07, 2018 4:10:04 pm PDT #1046 of 2023
And then Ortus came and said "It's Ortin' time" and they all Orted off into the sunset

Family was out and about this afternoon so we just watched now. The first ep with a new Doctor is always rough, and this time we've got a new showrunner as well...I think I will grow to love it, but it's going to take getting used to. And Peter Capaldi was MY DOCTOR in so many ways, as much as I adore Jodie Whittaker, she's new and different and I don't like change.

Dylan is 100% in, though. He loved it top to bottom.


Vortex - Oct 07, 2018 7:22:09 pm PDT #1047 of 2023
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman

I didn't really like Capaldi, so I am enjoying a new doctor.

I knew that the grandmother wasn't going to make it, she was too awesome. It wasn't just that she wasn't touted as a new companion, it's there was no way that she wouldn't have gone with The Doctor if she'd made it.

I did love the "Sheffield steel" line.


billytea - Oct 08, 2018 3:58:46 am PDT #1048 of 2023
You were a wrong baby who grew up wrong. The wrong kind of wrong. It's better you hear it from a friend.

I have watched the first episode! And I have thoughts. In a moment.

Family was out and about this afternoon so we just watched now. The first ep with a new Doctor is always rough, and this time we've got a new showrunner as well...I think I will grow to love it, but it's going to take getting used to. And Peter Capaldi was MY DOCTOR in so many ways, as much as I adore Jodie Whittaker, she's new and different and I don't like change.

This provokes so many thoughts for me.

1. Capaldi is so very much my Doctor too. (He is also superb in Torchwood - Children of Earth, but that's another matter.) One of the genius moves (in hindsight) the Beeb pulled with Doctor Who is regeneration, it transformed DW from an interesting feature of the 60s sci-fi landscape into something that can constantly renew itself and could in theory go on forever. I loved Capaldi in the role, but there are going to be people who found an acerbic older Doctor to be off-putting, so ok, it's time they get a turn too.

2. Biyi asked me last week if I thought I'd like Jodie Whittaker's Doctor. I pointed out that I've liked every single Doctor of the twelve so far (I have issues with Colin Baker's Doctor on-screen, but the audio adventures show that he can work quite well), so the odds are good.

3. Chris Chibnall... was not my first choice of new showrunner. (I did think it was time for a new showrunner. Moffat did much to redeem himself in my eyes with the Twelfth Doctor and especially Clara, but he is definitely a choice, and one that had about explored itself fully.) He's never written a classic episode of Doctor Who, and the eps he has written are occasionally problematic. It's taken effort to be optimistic about his tenure, but there are things that make me hopeful:

  • The casting decision. Jodie Whittaker is an excellent choice for many reasons.
  • He hasn't written classic Doctor Who, but he has now written classic television.
  • The changes he's made to production seem to play more to his strengths.
  • Likewise, the changes he's made suggest that he's making an effort to avoid the problematic elements.
  • He is a fan from way back. (There's footage from the 80s of a tiny teenage Chibnall taking to task the two most hack writers in the program's history, about the hackitude.)

More following.


billytea - Oct 08, 2018 4:02:01 am PDT #1049 of 2023
You were a wrong baby who grew up wrong. The wrong kind of wrong. It's better you hear it from a friend.

Now, the new episode! (Watched online, the recording was a bust, the chosen DVD was already full. Ryan was quite upset.) I was fairly disappointed. The plot wasn't anything special in Doctor Who terms. The most interesting twist was that Dr Teeth was cheating on his leadership exam (at least he's still eligible to sit on the Supreme Court), but it didn't lead anywhere. Early days on Whittaker's performance. There's definite promise, but it's obviously a first ep. It felt to me like Chibnall was trying to sound a bit too much like Moffat (or Davies). Not uncommon; Four's first adventure was basically a Third Doctor adventure with the Doctor written (but not quite played) like the Second Doctor.

A Doctor's first ep is an interesting beast. Consulting my Doctor Who database (YES I HAVE A DOCTOR WHO DATABASE DON'T JUDGE ME) they actually seem to be quite well received overall. But they're often very self-conscious. Ten's first go-round deliberately keeps him off the board (and everything is awful, don't you want him back?) until he finally pops out, all charisma and performance and aren't you just going to love me. Twelve had the ending phone call from Matt Smith begging the audience to give him a go. (Though Eleven's introduction felt pretty self-assured.)

In the classic series, I think they completely botched the intro to the Sixth and Seventh Doctors. Five regenerated in the penultimate adventure of his last season, so Six would get more of a look-in before the season break. Great idea, except his first adventure was crap, he wasn't himself for most of it (some introduction) and he violently assaulted his companion to boot. The audience just got time to wonder why they'd even tune in next season. (For the Seventh Doctor, the problems were simpler: his characterisation in that adventure wasn't how he wound up playing the role, and it was written by the aforementioned most hack writers in the program's history.)

The most interesting post-regeneration story, for mine, is the quite brilliant Power of the Daleks (introducing the Second Doctor). Nowadays regeneration is an event. But the first one was something new, and they leaned hard into it. It's a frightening event, with the Tardis freaking out and the new Doctor deliberately unsettling. Not at all sure how that played for the kids of 1966.

Back to Thirteen's introduction, it was a bit of an awkward beginning, but I'm cautiously optimistic. The best scenes, I think, were at the end, when the focus is on relationships. Going off Broadchurch, I'd expect that to be a strength under Chibnall's tenure (and three companions creates more opportunity). The Thirteenth Doctor should become better defined. And frankly, a less ambitious Doctor Who after the Capaldi era is probably good for viewing figures (especially when presenting the first woman in the role). UK ratings were excellent; hopefully they'll stick around.