Xander: We just saw the zebras mating! Thank you, very exciting... Willow: It was like the Heimlich, with stripes!

'Him'


Natter 71: Someone is wrong on the Internet  

Off-topic discussion. Wanna talk about corsets, duct tape, or physics? This is the place. Detailed discussion of any current-season TV must be whitefonted.


Gudanov - Jul 15, 2013 12:54:21 pm PDT #29295 of 30001
Coding and Sleeping

I think the Zimmerman case is a complicated stew of politics and law. TM was stalked and killed, but that's not necessarily illegal under Florida law, which is crazy enough itself.

Gun rights advocates might see the trial as a trial of the ability to defend oneself with a firearm. So that makes them pro-Zimmerman in a way. Plus I think there's an underlying conceit the NRA pushes that there are two groups of people: honest law-abiding citizens who legally purchase and own firearms and outlaws whom gun control can't prevent from getting guns. A guilty verdict would have undermined that conceit, therefore it must be true that Zimmerman was only defending himself, and TM being black makes that all the easier to believe due to racism. So I think that's a reason some might have to be pro-Zimmerman.

I'm sure for some it's a purely racist thing, i.e. TM being black makes him a thug and therefore it's reasonable that Zimmerman was assaulted.

While the jury may have been swayed by the racist image of a black male youth being a thug, Florida's stand your ground law would made conviction very difficult. There was such little evidence of what exactly happened and the bar for the use of lethal force is set so low. How do you decide if Zimmerman felt in danger of his life beyond a reasonable doubt? Not was, but felt? Legally, I don't know much about Florida law, but I got the impression that Zimmerman provoking the situation doesn't play into it.

Racism and Guns. That's a toxic brew.


le nubian - Jul 15, 2013 1:03:30 pm PDT #29296 of 30001
"And to be clear, I am the hell. And the high water."

Gud,

somehow I think the jury would have found a way to convict if the roles were reversed and TM was alive while GZ was dead. That's where I get lost on the strict legal interpretations of GZ's verdict.


Jesse - Jul 15, 2013 1:05:08 pm PDT #29297 of 30001
Sometimes I trip on how happy we could be.

I could shave my head Friday evening, and I'd have some stubble by Monday morning, it wouldn't be way different from my normal haircut.

Yeah, that doesn't sound radically different from what you have now.

Popsicle report: coconut water does NOT work. I was trying to buy coconut milk and failed. The good news is, I have some left and also some Coco Lopez, so I will mix them and try again.


SuziQ - Jul 15, 2013 1:11:43 pm PDT #29298 of 30001
Back tattoos of the mother is that you are absolutely right - Ame

Not sure what caused the coconut milk purchase failure. At my grocery store it isn't near the condensed or powdered milk but in the "international" aisle.


Gudanov - Jul 15, 2013 1:11:49 pm PDT #29299 of 30001
Coding and Sleeping

I think it's highly likely there would be a different outcome if the races were reverse. Though if this was say white-on-white of equal economic status, I think a guilty verdict would be tough with the law in this case.

I think racism certainly plays into the judgement of whether or not the shooter felt in danger. Then combine that with the Stand Your Ground law that makes everything worse because you've made the situation almost entirely subjective.

Then the whole thing gets even more toxic when you throw gun law in the mix.


§ ita § - Jul 15, 2013 1:14:46 pm PDT #29300 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

ISTG, coconut water is vomit juice to me. Like, some things are so gross I can't swallow. Semen's case-dependent, but the juice of the coconut does not pass these sphinctres EVER.

I just found the Pacific Rim Jaeger builder, and have been building Jamaican jaeger posters nonstop. Okay, stopped now.

Yeah, that doesn't sound radically different from what you have now.

Since I feel I need to cut my hair now, if I actually follow through on that I'll push bald off at least one haircut. I don't know if I can handle a work week of this length or more.


Gudanov - Jul 15, 2013 1:16:43 pm PDT #29301 of 30001
Coding and Sleeping

To be less roundabout, the problem with Florida Law is that essentially makes racism a legitimate reason to legally kill someone. It's a horrible verdict made even more horrible in that, under Florida Law, the jury's decision wasn't an outrageous interpretation of that Law.


brenda m - Jul 15, 2013 1:19:15 pm PDT #29302 of 30001
If you're going through hell/keep on going/don't slow down/keep your fear from showing/you might be gone/'fore the devil even knows you're there

Well put, Gud.


Gudanov - Jul 15, 2013 1:19:16 pm PDT #29303 of 30001
Coding and Sleeping

The gun lobby comes into it because it's the kind of law they want to push.


Jesse - Jul 15, 2013 1:19:59 pm PDT #29304 of 30001
Sometimes I trip on how happy we could be.

Not sure what caused the coconut milk purchase failure. At my grocery store it isn't near the condensed or powdered milk but in the "international" aisle.

Yeah, I was in the international aisle and thought I had the creamy stuff, but no, just the watery stuff. Frozen, it's mostly like water, and the coconut shreds and lime zest I added didn't do enough.

To be less roundabout, the problem with Florida Law is that essentially makes racism a legitimate reason to legally kill someone. It's a horrible verdict made even more horrible in that, under Florida Law, the jury's decision wasn't an outrageous interpretation of that Law.

Yeah, totally, 100%. The law is at least as outrageous as the rest of it.