But I do live in a world where people take a month off in the summer, so.

Heh. In 7 years here I've known one person to take a full month, and to be honest I'm still kind of bitter about the impact on the rest of us and that later in the year our manager gave her some extra time off at Thanksgiving.

Thanks, Brenda, that confirms my instinct, which was sort of that when we start to talk about start dates, I bring it up then. I mean, obviously they would not want to wait until after those 3 weeks, but it seems appropriate to bring up commitments at that point.

flea,

if you get the job offer, I would listen to the HR person's terms first and benefits, etc. see how long you have to think about the offer and then in your next conversation, mention that you had a family vacation planned for July 1-21. You would like to request unpaid leave for those 3 weeks, but you would like to know if there would be a problem with this and what procedures you need to do to request the leave. Can you work the difference (for example, put in an extra 5 hours a week until that time is made up)? I wouldn't bring up the seminar unless you absolutely HAVE to. It isn't their business really.

As far as salary: I usually recommend a counter offer of 10-20% more than the starting offer. In my line of work though, salary is important, but also so is other benefits. So, if my work pays for more of my benefits than I have to put in, I might not push as hard on salary.

I think you also need to get a sense of raises and expected raise schedule and what last year's raises (if there were any) were.

Oh yeah, I'd do it in the conversation where you accept the job for sure.

On negotiating, if you know the range they expect to pay, literally you just have to ask for a number toward the top of the range. They say, "We want to offer you the job, and the salary is XX." You say, "I was looking for something closer to X+Y. Is that possible?" The time off could also be part of that negotiation, if there isn't more money, maybe you could get more time off? (I have heard this exists, but have never actually experienced it myself.)

So your car is playing an April Fools trick on you? Bad manners.

Yes, let's go with that.

I am so used to being in a no-raise environment (at UGA nobody has gotten any raises since I was hired in August 2008 - in fact, one year we had furloughs) that it is hard to imagine! Also, I realize I know almost nothing about librarian rank and longevity of employment contracts in a public library setting (in an academic library there are usually 3-4 ranks to progress through, with associated raises, and tenure or continuing appointment at some institutions.) Must research.

The range is really big, though - like more than $25K wide - and I am at the entry level - this would be my first job with librarian as a title. So I shouldn't ask for or expect top of the range? I was just hoping to not come in at the basement, especially since I was basically working as a librarian but not being paid as one the last 2 years of my last job.

The time off could also be part of that negotiation, if there isn't more money, maybe you could get more time off? (I have heard this exists, but have never actually experienced it myself.)

My most recent hire asked for (and got) additional time off, Moneywise we gave her an offer that was slightly higher than what she had told HR was her target so there wasn't much room for her to move there.

t bitter

What is it with you people and companies who actually value employees?

I brought in $8M gross business last year. No bonus, no raise. Two weeks vacation. Asked for more instead of money increase at time of hire. Nope.

I was essentially told a few weeks ago that I was lucky I got time off when Rob died, since I hadn't been there a year yet and wasn't entitled to vacation. There is no bereavement leave.

edit: But my boss got a bonus based on our company's overall business. Whatever.

t /bitter

(Who am I kidding? That will never close until I get a new job.)

In the main contract for my work, the first 6 months are probationary, so it is highly advisable to negotiate any planned leave in that interim at the outset. They're actually really flexible with it because it isn't at all uncommon in the field for this to come up. However, it needs to be written into the hiring contract to protect both you and the employer.

As for negotiating, I have no input there. I asked for $5k more or more vacation. I was told NO. My contractor is a soulless evil corporate monstrosity where every employee is just a cost. They don't negotiate entry level.