Gah, Hil. You need a quieter place.

Also, now that I'm getting ready for work and my review, I'd like to repeat my request for ~ma from upthread. It'll all be over in about five hours. I'm not expecting anything awful, but I don't know what to expect.

Review ~ma Anne. Early reviewer says all awesomeness.

Lots of ~ma to you, Anne. I hope you were able to get some sleep.

Shir, men getting together to whine about how tough it is to be a man in today's society because society is just so unjust towards men, is a bit like Nile crocodiles complaining that modern tourists are just so hard on their teeth. That's not a perfect analogy, but the best I can come up with this early in the morning. Maybe it's more like the Romans whining that the people they conquered just don't understand. Actually, the best analogy is a bunch of white Americans reacting to the creation of African-American Studies classes by demanding Caucasian Studies classes. Men created the patriarchal society in which we live, and gathering like that isn't about them wanting to help eliminate the patriarchy and work to create a truly equal and fair society. It's more likely that what they are going to do is complain about how unfair women have been in trying to gain equality.

What seems to be the problem?

Roughly, the fact that male studies is 95% of the university world already.

I am SO in love with Spotted Justice and the Enforcer. I must have a subscription!

I certainly don't have any statistics or even a guess as to how common misandry is compared to misogyny. In my personal experience I hear way too many comments from women that paint a blanket, "all men are (insert insult here)." Perhaps I hear more blanket insults about men because the women spouting the hatred think I might agree. (which I don't because I love many men) It could be that I don't hear the blanket insults to women as much because people don't dare say that crap in front of me.

It doesn't bother me that the boys want their program. Whatever. Might be worthwhile, might be a waste of resources. I can't tell by the site.

It does bug when people judge individuals by their gender alone. I know both women (including my sisters!) and men that do this and I challenge it when I hear it. Which is likely why I hang here because it is a safe zone from that kind of thing.

What. Laura. Said.

I'm reading and nodding and not saying much because of the craxy and the last reason i asked for some ~ma.

And now I'm back to ask for a little health~ma and let-it-be-nothing-but-stress~ma. Hoping I don't overload the ~ma channel.

I was afraid of these answers, hoping that this convention, or the academics that will talk there, are notoriously wrong and In Need for a Clue. But in this case, I disagree.

I think you're mixing here two issues.

Yes, there is patriarchy. And yes, women are the ones that mostly hurt by it. But women are also the ones who enables it, assisting as mediators. And to me, saying and this kind of conventions aren't important is like saying that all men are bad and all women are good. So yes, there's Patriarchy and there are Men, just as there is Feminism and there are Women. Saying that every man is a P7 is wrong, just as not every woman is a feminist.

Edit: And bottom line, we can't understand the effects of patriarchy on women alone, without including the effects of it on men.

I don't know why you're rushing to determine that these kind of conventions and dialogs won't be helpful to get a better understanding and elimination of patriarchy. By understanding better the social construction and understanding of what a man is (read: supposed to be, look like and act like), we'll understand patriarchy, and maybe ourselves and the world, better. If I am a woman, and constructed to be "the other", I'd like to know exactly what I'm facing, who is this kind of person which is supposedly not me that I Can't Be, that Anti-Other.

Women come in all kinds of shapes, men in fewer (I think). However, they're still there. Exposing the stereotypes of what Man and a Woman is and the changes those stereotypes went through can be good, for all (men in the ancient world could and used to cry in public and be open about their emotions, mostly the Romans; it's well documented. Boys in Victorian England were taught not to show any emotion at all, and "stiff upper lip", as far as I know, comes from that age. It's not a coincidence, IMHO, that so much of the fantasy literature that came in the end of and after that era had the basic idea of "you have to go out to and run away in order to escape this").

It is a man's world, and yes, the history of dead white males is what mostly being studies in universities (though in mine, in almost every class there will be at least 1/5 that will be dedicated to women's studies). But by ignoring what a "man" is, we'd do unjust not only to them, but to women as well, because then you basically say that gender and feminism are only matters regarding to women, IMHO. So I suggest to see them not as a bunch of whiners who are ignoring women and feminism (and if they do, no better time and place than these conventions to show them How It Supposed To Be Done and how they can assist making this world a better world), but as partners. We are together on this Earth, and our ways of living are too interwoven to say that men are the great oppressors of this world (maybe the Manly Thinking, but not men in specific). These conventions aren't supposed to be the place where the Great White Males are gathered up and congratulating each other for dominating the world.

(I'm apologizing for typos. Still not feeling very well).