I'm sure you're right, but I don't see why that means we get such mediocre writing from a team whose writing was what set them apart.

Right?? I don't think I'd be as disappointed as I am if my standards for Mutant Enemy weren't so high. The show is fine. But I'd love for it to be great.

If this is a straight procedural, it needs better cases-of-the-week. If this is a character driven long-form story show, it needs better characters and better mythos. Right now I don't think it's doing either one well.

I think that's fair, I just disagreed with your original blanket statement about characters.

And it's Jed and Maurissa running the show, right? I don't think they are quite a known quantity yet.

Did anyone watch Spartacus ? That's the last show they ran. I think they had a fair hand in Dollhouse as well. Unless you mean "known quantity" in the sense that they wouldn't have clout to overrule Marvel's suggestions.

Oh yeah, I meant known quantity to me! Which is probably not the same thing as in the world, eh?

Apart from the reference to the Battle of New York and Couslon being different, this episode had nary a nod to the Marvel Universe at all; it could have been any show about spies doing spy stuff (Agents of SD-6). On the one hand, I think this allowed it to establish its own identity and play to its strengths, and on the other hand, the show has a delicate line to walk when the first name in its title is "Marvel." Too Marvel and it's pandering, not enough Marvel and why be Marvel at all?

Something that REALLY threw me was the shot of the catwalk over the plane's cargo bay. I know people have made sarcastic comments about Joss sneaking Firefly back on the air, but did they really have to recycle the ship set?

I am liking Skye and Agent Lone Wolf better, but am idling on the technobabble twins and Coulson is actually losing ground with me.

I keep waiting for them to say something like "We should run this past Stark" when they run into brand new tech. Perhaps they're saving it for something robotic, a la Thor's (first) movie.

Some of my dissatisfaction with the show is dread about what they're going to reveal about Coulson. I don't *want* him to be a clone/LMD/whatever. I was actually quite happy that that wasn't a plot point, till Amador brought it up.

Probably the same set designer -- I do know that split-level sets do make for more dramatic staging....

I was actually quite happy that that wasn't a plot point, till Amador brought it up.

How is that different from what they've been hammering home since the pilot?

Some of my dissatisfaction with the show is dread about what they're going to reveal about Coulson. I don't *want* him to be a clone/LMD/whatever. I was actually quite happy that that wasn't a plot point, till Amador brought it up.

I think it has been a point all season. It was just more subtle before last night. And I want it to be something big, otherwise it cheapens the sacrifice in the Avengers for me.

I keep waiting for them to say something like "We should run this past Stark" when they run into brand new tech. Perhaps they're saving it for something robotic, a la Thor's (first) movie.

I'm guessing this is going to connect with whatever they did to Coulson. If the character last night was able to see something in Coulson, I'm guessing Stark would be able to figure it out pretty quickly as well. So, they're keeping him away.

I love that Fitz and Simmons were given some separate personalities last night, and I'm really beginning to love them.

There's the organization behind almost-exploding not!Gunn in the premiere, who maybe are also behind party-trick eyeball!Amador. But they don't really feel like a big deal, probably because SHIELD isn't talking about them.

To me it feels like a slow build toward a big bad. Like on Buffy when we heard about the Mayor a few times before we knew anything about him.

Right, which is why they don't count. There's nothing driving the action forward, really. It's just a bunch of quippy attractive people flying around in a superplane solving crimes. Which isn't to say it's not fun, but the show still hasn't answered the question of why they're doing it at all.

Because they can,and therefore they have an obligation to? Honestly, I don't understand this at all. How is this any different than any other show with a monster of the week format?