has there been a point in what we've seen so far where we're supposed to think that the Dollhouse is right in what they do?

If it weren't for the Dollhouse, the kidnapped girl in the pilot would have been raped and murdered. It was very specifically set up so that only "Miss Penn" could have put that together in time to prevent it.

has there been a point in what we've seen so far where we're supposed to think that the Dollhouse is right in what they do?

No, I don't think we're supposed to think they're right, but handler-guy said that British-woman likes to tell herself they're doing good. That was never explained, but I think we're supposed to believe that they find a way to excuse it to themselves.

If it weren't for the Dollhouse, the kidnapped girl in the pilot would have been raped and murdered. It was very specifically set up so that only "Miss Penn" could have put that together in time to prevent it.

Yeah, but they wanted the guy's money! He's frightened and desperate! Of course they were going to tell him that they're the best solution for getting his girl back! I just don't know that the people who are running the evil organization should count as a reliable narrator.

And, in the meta sense, if the guy doesn't agree to have the Dollhouse fix his problem, then there isn't a show. Sloppy when you compare it with real life? Sure. But how often do TV formulaic scenarios actually reflect how real life operates?

Yeah, but they wanted the guy's money! He's frightened and desperate! Of course they were going to tell him that they're the best solution for getting his girl back!

I'm not talking about the characters setting up that way, I'm talking about Joss.

The Dollhouse operators didn't know that they were sending their client a hostage negotiator with the imprinted memories of a girl who was molested by one of the kidnappers. But without those memories, another hostage negotiator wouldn't have guessed that the current victim was at risk for rape/death until it was too late. Take the Dollhouse out of the situation and the girl dies. That's how the ep is written.

That's how the ep is written.

And that's what makes me wonder how much of the content of that episode is Joss and how much is network effect.

I think consent can happen without knowing the other person, in rare instances. For example, if a guy uses a glory hole, he could have no idea who is going to give him a blow job but I would say that he has consented.

I don't think that we're supposed to think they're good, just that they facilitated a good thing. I think we're supposed to regard them as dodgy at best, and that's one of the points of the show.

if a guy uses a glory hole, he could have no idea who is going to give him a blow job, but I would say that he has consented.

I hate to get all male-gaze-y, but I would say that if a guy is sticking his dick in something, he's pretty much consented to the act of *him* penetrating something/one.

That brings us back to the question of business model. Prostitution(rape included or not depending on definition) is part of it, the one thing they can always do better than a conventional pimp or madame. Erika and I think others suggested that highly confidential errands (whether legal like personal assistant or an assassination) would also be something they could offer. I don't think the forgetting is as big a guarantee as it seems at first glance. So your active forgets. But a big evil organization knows. And I'm not sure I would take their word they don't listen in, and don't record the memories of their active before erasing them. But, like a lot of illegal businesses, they do respect confidentiality and don't blackmail just as a matter of long term self-interest in remaining an on-going business. So even if the client does not trust the "nobody knows your secret" claim, they probably are confident their secret will be kept.

Their are a couple of other aspects: guaranteed expertise and instant availability. Since any active can be loaded with an expert imprint, and apparently they have memories of real people, you can hire an expert through them and be guaranteed that the expert will really be able to do the job whether the job is legal or illegal. Need an asassin? They can provide a highly competent sociopath on short notice. Need a kidnapping negotiator? Whether their negotiator is the best or not, at minimum they can guarantee that the expertise is real. Imagine you are Bill Gates and Melissa is kidnapped, and for some reason you don't think going to the police is the right thing to do. For all your billions, do you know how to select a qualified kidnapping negotiators? I mean if they offer credentials, do you know how to evaluate them? If you are hiring someone else to evalute that expert, how do you know the evalators are good? Someone who can create an instant expert, complete with real memories and real experience recorded from someone with a top record in the field may really be your best shot.

Also, if you are unethical enough to use them at all, the advantages of being able to get your high value labor via one stop shopping, with a quality guarantee you trust might have real advantages. If a few days work done right can make a difference of millions, it might be worth a very high price for guarantee that work is done right. And if what you are buying is illegal quality guarantees are probably very hard to come by, even for a billionare.

It's funny because the sense I'm getting is that the actives are for short-term jobs. I wonder how long a new personality can last in an active before things start going south (a la Alpha).

So you really couldn't have Echo as your personal assistant, but maybe they could bring in a different assistant each week?