I don't see a problem with negotiating where grades are concerned if you can back it up with something reasonable. I've had teachers glad that students cared enough to try and make their point and sometimes learned more from it.

However, I do have a problem with the kind of thing that happened at my high school, where it was widely considered that both the valedictorian and saluditorian were chosen because they had the pushiest parents. Both of their mothers were well known for petitioning teachers for grades and extra time for tests. One of the families was very infulential in the area because the father was the president of a professional sports team. And yet the kid who also got a perfect GPA and a 1600 on his SATs and took a harder course load had parents who were imigrants and had never been seen at the school didn't get anything.

I had a college friend who got very very irate with me any time I got an extension on a paper.

Yeah, I had a roommate that was ALWAYS getting extensions on papers. Which, even though we were in completely different majors, annoyed me. I mean, I was doing a lot of the same stuff she was, but I had to take my chem tests on time! And while occasionally it was that she was sick, more often it was that she'd been putting too much time in at the theater (which was extracurricular, and I did too), which I was like "Dude. Optional. Not a good reason" (she'd often be like "Oooh, I'm sooooo sick" when it was more overwork or a little sick plus a lot of staying up all night)

I never even asked my profs questions in college, for my undergrad at least, because I thought it would look like I wanted an unfair advantage, and the answer would be in the library anyway.

I love Raq's pedantry story. It makes me think of the small revolution that put an end to our "thou shalt not affix anything to the fancy new glass cubicle doors" rule. Someone went away on a family emergency for, like, a month, and put up a post-it saying that she'd had to leave town. Local pedant put up another post-it to say that the first post-it was a violation. Local snark pointed out the irony. Local pedant posted a "no, I'm serious".

And by the time family emergency woman got back (completely unaware of the entire post-it flame war, natch) the outside of her cube was completely wallpapered, and ever since, people not only freely post-itify, but use the glass doors for goofy doodling with dry-erase markers.

I am Kristin WRT students who want to renegotiate their writing grade and/or bargain for extra credit, grade based on effort not output, etc. And in that vein, I have a student right now who stopped coming to class in February, turned in one of 4 required papers, no final, and no homework. I turned in grades yesterday. He now wants to know what he can do to pass my class. Seriously?!

Ha, you rules followers! I mock you and your faith in being enfranchised in an equitable system.

I'd like this to be my new tag.

meara, all I can say is: karma. That's the only consolation sometimes.

I never even asked my profs questions in college, for my undergrad at least, because I thought it would look like I wanted an unfair advantage, and the answer would be in the library anyway.

Opposite for me. I discovered the huge advantage of a small liberal arts college is that you have full professors teaching you (not grad students) and they have lots of office hours and you'd be foolish not to take advantage of picking their brains. That's why their brains were there.

Hell, yeah, I'm going to impose on the smart people I'm paying and get private tutorials!

But that was part of the culture of Kenyon. You were supposed to take advantage of that.

::points and mocks lawful good meara::

::makes secret sign to fellow anarchist Raq::

I'd like this to be my new tag.

Do it! Nobody's tagged me in forever.

meara, all I can say is: karma. That's the only consolation sometimes.

...um, she had a really ugly boyfriend? Who was a freak? And is now her husband of ten years and father of her recent baby? She lives in Minnesota where it's COLD and nasty in the winter? She stopped speaking to me after I came out and I only know all this third hand? Eh.

I'm totally lawful good, it's true. But then a lot of the authority figures aren't pleased because I tend to sit there and *follow* the rules, but I like to snark about them when they're stupid or annoying...

Oh, and re: grade changes -- one of my students last year (who would have been one of my absolute favorites if I didn't love all my students exactly the same amount) visibly worked up her courage (with the help of her therapist, who ACCOMPANIED her on this visit) to ask me about her grade. It turned out that I'd mixed up her grade with the person next on the class list (don't get me started on manual bubble-sheet grading) and she really had earned a B- instead of a D. So there are definitely times to ask, and I not only changed her grade but wrote a glowing letter to her chosen high school explaining my mistake and what a great student she is.