But GEN Petraeus is not part of the Bush Administration.

(eta: which is why I don't like it. but i'm done with work and off to the dr. so I'll see you all later.)

But GEN Petraeus is not part of the Bush Administration.

I know, and I apologize if I gave the impression that he is.

But it's not as though he's able to act independently of the White House, either.

I just meant....eh, you know what? Fuck it. I'm tired, it's just a silly rhyme-y nickname that made me giggle because I'm 12 and possibly treasonous.

It's my understanding Officers, especially ranking ones, can have difficulties in voicing differing opinions against the administration. My BiL, finally retired, USMC Gunnery Sgt, at one point was offered to mustang up to Lt. He refused, one of the reasons being, "If I wanna bitch about the idiot on Penn ave, I don't want a Court Martial about it".

But GEN Petraeus is not part of the Bush Administration.

I think that line's a lot blurrier than is healthy anymore. Not with the Armed Forces in general, but Petraeus, and some of the others who've been closely tied with them? I'm not sure how to articulate it, but I think Petraeus is not not part of the Administration.

wow, in the time it took to write my last comment, like 3 more popped up.

Sorry for opening a firestorm Bitches.

In an effort to change the topic....

--> LOOK ! WEATHER !

shit. It's Southern California here. There is no weather.

um. SEX! CORSETS! Ya! We are doing a show with a bunch of cute women in corsets! And..and...and.. o! and I ordered 500 condoms! (will it work? Think they are distracted?)

I mentioned a couple of years ago, when I was organizing the military law office, about the Lt. who wrote emails to his wife about his actual experience in Iraq. He has suffered mightily...just for telling the truth.

I think that line's a lot blurrier than is healthy anymore. Not with the Armed Forces in general, but Petraeus, and some of the others who've been closely tied with them? I'm not sure how to articulate it, but I think Petraeus is not not part of the Administration.

This administration has put a lot of work into breaking down the separation of powers. I don't think its much of a leap to believe they've aggressively blurred the lines between themselves and the armed forces as well.

I think the tone was set when prior to the Iraq invasion, a general gave an honest, accurate assessment of the number of troops required to occupy the country. His numbers were much higher than Rumsfeld thought would be necessary. The general was publicly ridiculed and essentially fired, which sent a strong message to the military on what would happen to you if you didn't give the administration what it wanted.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that up until the point of an illegal order, GEN Petraeus is following orders reporting things as the administration asks

Which is why Congress and the American Public had to wait for his report, right? Because it's so independent and unbiased.

The "Betray Us" thing did get me to react and pay attention, so I guess it worked. Then it made me roll my eyes and think how sinking to the No-SPin Zone level isn't helpful.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that up until the point of an illegal order, GEN Petraeus is following orders reporting things as the administration asks or talking to the reporters he is asked to speak to. I doubt very much that he, himself, chose to talk to FOX only. I agree - it looks bad, and I bet he agrees, but I think it's wrong to ascribe personal feelings to the actions of a soldier.

I'd find this easier to support if the system of checks and balances WRT war and the military weren't so thoroughly broken (and was already broken when Bush got there, though his administration has made it worse). Since no one seems to care any more that Congress is supposed to declare wars, you've essentially got military power entirely in the pocket of one branch of government. And when that branch is as corrupt as Dubya & Co., that's frightening and IMHO simply wrong. I say that as a person who's not at all anti-military and comes from a family with a long tradition of military service.