I wonder how Mary explained to John about what happened.

Probably in ways that make sense to someone who doesn't know about the supernatural. The same story she'd have given to the police.

So, what are RAH rules? And Sam is supposed to be an angelic mole among the demon army? Am I tracking what you said there?

"All roads lead to the same destination. If we're giving the directions. Which we are. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain."

Yeah, there's a certain lack of trustworthiness there. Especially since he's telling Dean to stop Sam, but if he can't, "Oh, we'll do it, whatever, just give it a college try, huh?"

So much heartbreak in this episode. So much explained, though, and so much better than I would have imagined.

I think I know what you mean, Plei. Although, if the angels/God knew they would need Sam to be in the inside mole for Azael's scheme, why couldn't they just ... get rid of Azazel? Castiel's told Dean his comrades have fallen, which meant they were fighting, when the Witnesses were raised.

A lot. Man, such a lot of canon to digest.

I wonder how Mary explained to John about what happened.

I don't think she told him much at all which is why he was so confused and unprepared when she died.

To continue that thought, if Mary knew YED was going to come to drip on Sam, that would explain why there no salt lines or sigils or devil's traps anywhere in that nursery. If she meant to hold up her end of the bargain, she would have to leave him unprotected. Because otherwise, knowing what she knew, she should have had some sort of protection there

I don't know if he told her. He promised her that everyone would be okay if he wasn't interrupted. She had to think that meant Sam too. Which although she is naive, I don't think she would consider that to be okay. I don't think she knew. I think she made the deal for John and was kind of swept away by the action after that point.

So, what are RAH rules? And Sam is supposed to be an angelic mole among the demon army? Am I tracking what you said there?

Basically, that in the timeline of the story you are reading or following, if someone goes back in time, they've always gone back in time, and everything's always happened as if they've gone back in time. (Handwavium, I believe, is strong in RAH's stories. Even if it's been over a decade since last I read them.)

Sam's the mole who probably doesn't know he's a mole, but he's been planted there "a purpose" as Mrs McGregor would say (too much Beatrix Potter for me) so that the angels can figure out how to get the edge. (Who knows, maybe in some alternate possible future where Mary never runs into the YED, she winds up hunting again, and the angel's catch Dean's scent that way. Handwavium! It's what's for supper!)

Has anyone re-watched "Houses of the Holy" since Castiel appeared? I wonder how some parts of that would play now that we know what we know.

(Edit: I originally said "reappeared," which now makes me want to play with the idea that it was Castiel who interfered at the end of HotH.)

Is RAH Robert A. Heinlein?

I think I know what you mean, Plei. Although, if the angels/God knew they would need Sam to be in the inside mole for Azael's scheme, why couldn't they just ... get rid of Azazel? Castiel's told Dean his comrades have fallen, which meant they were fighting, when the Witnesses were raised.

Red tape! It's all about red tape and bureaucracy! I swear! You have to do things through the proper channels! In triplicate. You can't interfere directly with the wheels in motion, but you can fudge things a bit.

...

I should just write this. In my copious free time. Sigh.

Who's RAH?

This is my problem with not knowing what rules apply to which ... creatures, I guess. If the angels and God can know what much, what's stopping them from using their power to smite Azazel?

Here, you're saying they always needed Sam to be one of those kids, because Sam would fight using the power for the evil, and they could get the inside track through Dean, yes? So Castiel sent Dean back simply so he could get the full effect of what had happened, i.e. the "truth" he never knew. Yes?

I can see so easily what you mean about Home now. Mary was, in my mind, completely apologizing to Sam for making the deal, for all of it. And the way she addressed Dean, yeah -- much more like an old friend than her son, since he was finally the young man she had once met.

But is Sam a sacrificial mole? Is his role to be the beacon, or whatever, and he has no agency or destiny of his own?

'Cause. I need to talk to some angels, if that's the case. Even stern and implacable good guys can't damn a person with no possibility of redemption.