Okay, I lied. First thing I thought was "oh John, oh Mary" during the THEN previouslies. Then I thought Dean needs to kick Sammy's ass and soon. Then I went all irrational and started on my Lawrence tirade. I blame the debate for getting me riled.

I'm better now. Hugs Boys, Hugs John, Hugs Castiel. ::gropes Castiel::

The downtown location was the same one from Simon Said--the grey stone pillars, although the camera didn't pan up to the clock at the top this time. The nighttime bridge location (as I mentioned upthread amidst some unfolding story squee, so it was less noteworthy) was the one from Hookman.

I'm sure the X-Files filmed in each of those locations, probably more than once. But my eye does that thing, whether for actors or landmarks.

Seems to me that if Dean couldn't change it, then his presence there had no effect on the occurance, either. It would have happened one way or another. He was, said and done, merely an observer.

But if Dean didn't tell them about the second woman meeting up with YED, Mary and her father wouldn't have gone out there, so Mary and YED may not have met, so in a way, Dean is responsible.

Yeah, but it does seem that Dean had a moment of Mohinder levels of stupid. He told the YED that "I'm the one who kills you". Way to make sure the YED makes plans that extend past his destruction.

Maybe the whole destiny thing means that nothing he does has any affect. But he does not know that at the time. And it strikes me that maybe time travel to the past can change things in the limited sense of getting information that can change things after the presence. After all, that is what it did for Dean. Maybe it works both ways. Maybe nothing Dean did changed anything up to the moment Castiel sent him back in time, but it may have refined the YED plan in such a way that it affects what is happening to Sam now.

Is Ruby part of the plan? Either wittingly, or as an unknowing manipulated pawn?

Could someone please tell me the exchange where we find out Dean was named for his grandmother? Our signal was dreadful for the first 20 minutes or so, and we missed a lot of dialog.

oops

It's when he first meets the family and learns their names. Mitchpa is Samuel, Grandma is Deanna

Ha! Oh, that's awesome.

so Mary and YED may not have met, so in a way, Dean is responsible.

May not have met, yet. Azazel said he'd had his eye on Mary. Even if he hadn't gotten her that night, he still would have gotten her.

Yeah, this is where time travel gets hinky. Castiel told Dean, it didn't matter if he went back, he couldn't change anything. Which means, if he could not affect it postively, he could not affect it negatively. Samuel and Deanna were meant to die and Mary would make her deal with Azazel. Dean was not required for that to happen; it was intended strictly an object lesson/fact finding mission for him.

Holy shit, this show is so fucking awesome this season. I don't normally capslock about this show, but I kind of feel like running around yelling HOLY SHIT MARY WAS A HUNTER and HOLY SHIT THE YED KILLED THEIR GRANDPARENTS and HOLY SHIT HE KILLED JOHN and HOLY SHIT MARY MADE A DEAL and HOLY SHIT THERE'S STILL AN ENDGAME PAST DISCOUNT DEMON ARMY and HOLY SHIT GOD IS GOING TO SMITE SAM.

Also, in more superficial news, HOLY SHIT DEAN PARADOXICALLY GOT HIMSELF THE IMPALA.