Hey, JP, Samantha Ferris (and NB) are going to be at this con in Chicago in November.

Question for you all before I start watching the Jo-centric episodes: Was it ever established when Bill Harvelle was killed or how old Jo was when it happened?

Not that I can remember offhand. I've read several different ages in fic. But definitely Jo was old enough to have a relationship with Bill, say eight or nine, I think.

Excellent... I can work with those numbers.

dashes off to plot some more

Jo mentions she was "still in pigtails" when he died, at one point. You can do a little math, to the effect that she's probably Sam's age (more or less), and John worked with Bill after his whole annus horribilis (1983), so for her to remember Bill in any detail he had to have died no earlier than, say, 1988, when she was about five. And if she was still wearing pigtails when she was ten (1993), that would be weird. So that gives you some vague boundaries to the range, depending on your assessment of how old she is.

(The weird part of that story, for me, is the idea that Dean would never have heard one word about the Harvelles. I mean, in 1988, he's nine, which is getting up there in the "snoop on what your parents are doing" range. And by 1993, he's fourteen, which is definitely in the snooping range, and only two years removed from his self-proclaimed first solo kill -- which, unless the learning curve is wicked steep, means he should have been John's assistant already. There's a story in there somewhere, but someone other than me should write it.)

Excellent info. Thank you ever so much.

The weird part of that story, for me, is the idea that Dean would never have heard one word about the Harvelles.

That is weird. And I think it just fattened my plot bunny considerably.

I wanted Cassie to be ... pricklier. Someone he really had to be on his toes with.

And again, I give you exhibit a: Tracie Thoms.

See, if they had cast her as this recurring glamazon hunter Ruby, there would not have been a peep of complaint out of me. I could easily see her out-Deaning Dean.

Honestly, though, how much would a human of JP's size have to drink to get that drunk? Lots.

Really depends on heritage and how much tolerance you've built up—I know hefty lightweights, and was not a lightweight myself at 150 lbs. and little prior experience. I can see Dean drinking him under the table despite the mass disadvantage, practice having made perfect.

Plot holes, Nutty! Use your handwavium!

Matt, that casting idea is BRILLIANT. Too bad it's not, you know, true. Sad now.

Gummy worms:

I get the drunk thing, too, Matt. Sam is not a regular drinker the way Dean is made out to be. And his mix of drinks was ... ambitious.

I have a friend my size (5'4"ish) who can drink my husband (6'0") under the table, but she drinks a LOT, so I should have figured.

If the non-canon plot in the comics is to be believed, John took the boys to the Roadhouse very early on, within the first year after Mary's death. So working from that, it's kinda absurd that Dean wouldn't remember the Harvelles, unless the hunt that killed Bill Harvelle happened really early on. Which just doesn't fit.

Of course, the comics kinda suck on plot. Like Jo's full name . And how many doors the Impala has.