So, is it a moral failing if all the demon-cosmology talk is Blah blah blah sulfur, blah blah blah bad hair day? Because, I have to say, I don't care the first thing about who demons are, how they got that way, what they want, or who does their hair. I find it so incredibly boring, and can't imagine how it can really matter to the storyline without the storyline going severely kerblooey from where it's gone in the past. I mean, this is a show where every problem can be solved with a chain saw (or similar) -- while I often ask for more intelligent plotting, it's not wordiness I'm asking for.

I think I might be a little more interested if it weren't so closely based on cod-Christian stuff, but mostly I'm just like, "Yes, horror movie details, is this part of the torture, or can we just move on directly to the evisceration?"

On Edit: Yeah IMTOD

Avert thine eyes, Nutty.

Part of the Lucifer myth-busting (that may or may not be in the link I... linked) (and as I understood it) is that not only is Lucifer a misnomer for Satan (rather it was a line of mockery directed at Satan, calling him "Morning Light/Star"), but that there is no mention in the Bible that states that Satan was once an angel that fell from heaven/God's grace. Maybe there is other text, apocryphal or not, that relates this story, but it's not in teh Bible.

I kinda wonder if that "son" and "daughter" thing that Yellow Eyes was spouting was metaphorical.

This was my interpretation. Son or daughter = follower. Of course, the other way is interesting too. Star-crossed lover demons who met, flayed and maimed, fell in love and had kids.

Yeah IMTOD

I thought Tessa was telling Dean that "angry spirits" were born from those ghosts that refused to cross over, not that they turned into demons. I assumed she was just talking about ghosts that cause problems and need to be handled like the Roadkill guy. I think about demons as a seperate monster. Am I misremembering the conversation or was there another reference in that episode? 'Cause that would be really interesting.

I am loving all the demonology and talk of Lucifer and Azazel. Anything that portrays Angels as something terrifying and without white wings and a halo, and I am hooked. I didn't see the show going this way, but I will be so very happy if they follow through with this. That's just...neat!

There's a lot of info on the Lucifer page of Wikipedia. (An expert on faith, religion, and mythology, I know...)

I thought Tessa was telling Dean that "angry spirits" were born from those ghosts that refused to cross over, not that they turned into demons.

Yeah like I said, I was speculating. What you have is all the text supports. But it was also obvious from other episodes that ghosts can have very different personalities than when alive. Remember the episode with two ghostly victims of the accident. The lady who had been driving the car did not even know she was dead, but also seemed to have a lot of what she was when we she was alive. The guy who had been crossing the road and was hit knew damn well he was dead, and kept torturing every anniversary of his death. And the torturer, who had been a nice guy in life, was not really even seeking revenge any more. He had figured out that torturing her spirit was what let him stick around, and he did not want to move on. And he seemed to have a lot less of his original self left. He also seemed to be very powerful compared to her - able to burst through windows and move things around. You could extrapolate from that to angry spirits losing more and more of their old personalty, turning more and more to evil, growing more and more powerful, and eventually becoming demons. Some people speculate that many of the gods in old polytheistic religions started out as spirits in ghost stories, and that as popular spirit characters attracted more and better tales, they started being described as gods instead of ghosts.

And this kind of speculations is not really an attempt to read the mind of writers, more an attempt to fill in a gap. Since, as someone put it upthread, the theology in Supernatural was scribbled on a napkin in the men's restroom, for some of us it is fun to figure out a more consistent world based on the hints dropped - even if we doubt the writers have thought it through that much.

So the point of the speculation is that it would make a good background for the series and is not absolutely contradicted by the series (so long as we assume a great many unreliable narrators). I suspect the series writers are actually going for a more conventional heaven/hell scenario.

Oh and over in bitches Beth B comment about the mirrors on the ceiling:

the fic just writes itself

Title for the new thread when it rolls over in 6,000+ posts?

And this kind of speculations is not really an attempt to read the mind of writers, more an attempt to fill in a gap. Since, as someone put it upthread, the theology in Supernatural was scribbled on a napkin in the men's restroom, for some of us it is fun to figure out a more consistent world based on the hints dropped - even if we doubt the writers have thought it through that much.

We used to do the same with Buffy. I never got the impression that Buffyverse theology was well-crafted either.

For some reason, I thought that Nov 1st was Sam's birthday when it is clearly his half-birthday.

I wonder if that will be mentioned in the episode?

I think that this is a slightly longer version of the promo.