He'd borrowed a toy and would not give it back - at an age when you are old enough to know better. I'd say at that point your choice is:

1)fight
2)send in a grownup

Cause he is not going to be talked into giving it back. It is not just that he wants the gameboy or whatever it was. He is enjoying the bullies thrill in humiliation and taking away someone else's stuff.

Cause he is not going to be talked into giving it back. It is not just that he wants the gameboy or whatever it was. He is enjoying the bullies thrill in humiliation and taking away someone else's stuff.

And I think Ben really taught him a lesson he needed to learn.

In a comparable situation for real kids in real life, I'd still say beating the kid up would be the right thing to do. Even if he was tougher than you and you got beat up it would still be the right thing to do as long as you got some good enough licks to make sure he bled a little, so he was not so quick to choose you as a target the next time. I'd probably make an awful parent.

Right. Of course, having an adult sitting there watching it happen is all wrong.

When it comes to bullies I've got issues.... I learned the hard way and after years of suffering that you have to fight back no matter what. My parents were into pacifism while I'm growing up, so it took me longer than your average bear to learn about the whole fighting back thing. (My Dad did not actually believe in pacifism, but deferred to my Mom on child raising. Frankly, unless a kid is being raised amid The Gentle People, I don't think kids should be taught non-violence until they are old enough to be in a situation where violence is not routine, and old enough to be skeptical of what they are taught.)

It's kind of a litigious society these days. I'm all for teaching mini!Dean to beat the kid up, personally, but you never know what's going to come of that.

Also? Not Dean's kid. He definitely overstepped, in my opinion. Even if, like I said, I think Ben was better for knowing he could stand up for himself and get results.

Oh and back to Supernatural. That fic linked to upthread was based on some reasoning about the whole issue of Ben and whether he was Dean's mini-me.

The logic was:

If Lisa used a blood test to determine whether the kid and was Dean's or the biker, and Dean did not know about the test, then obviously the biker was tested.

OK the biker was ethical enough to take part in the test, and Ben seemed to genetically inherit the macho asshole hero code of ethics. So you would expect the biker to visit on occasions like Ben's birthday, to send an occasional check. Not to be a real father - not visiting enough, not sending his fair share of expenses, but doing something.

Well he could be a total asshole rather than a hero asshole, but in the SNverse I'm assuming not. So if he is not there - why? Well he could have been hit by a truck, or in jail. but again in the SNverse I'm assuming something more angsty, and involving the forces of darkness. Hence the short-short fic.

Frankly, unless a kid is being raised amid The Gentle People, I don't think kids should be taught non-violence until they are old enough to be in a situation where violence is not routine, and old enough to be skeptical of what they are taught.

I think it's more nuanced than that. Small children need to be told to play nice, share, don't hit/bite/whatever. I suspect it's the ones who aren't taught this who become bullies. When they reach the age that they are encountering bullies then they need to learn to stand up for themselves. They need to learn proper and acceptable behavior first and then add the caveat of what can sometimes be necessary.

The other dad wasn't a biker-- he was a bar back in a biker joint.

Hmm - well if he was bartender in a biker joint, he could have been a biker as well. (Rationalizing for the sake of my fic.)

And I remember she said that "scars and no fixed address" was her type.