And I think if he receives an Oscar, it's going to be as much for his body of work as it is for this particular role.

(like saying he deserves the Oscar for his role)

This was a big debate I got into with the friend I saw the movie with.

I'm foot stompingly opposed to posthumous awards that are not for the purpose of inspiring others to avoid something terrible. (Medger Evers leaps to mind)

Appreciating a body of work is one thing. Special award to help us collectively work out "Oh Heath, we hardly knew ye," is one thing.

Depriving a living candidate of an opportunity so that we can collectively say, "It's a drag what happened to you," is to my way of thinking, a mistake.

I have not illusions that Oscars are based on actual merit. Tatum O'Neill in Paper Moon, I'm looking at you.

Tatum O'Neill in Paper Moon, I'm looking at you.

Well, yeah, but I love Paper Moon.

Peter Finch was awarded an Oscar posthumously for Network, the difference being that he passed away after he was nominated, but before the ceremony.

Well, yeah, but I love Paper Moon.

Totally agreed! Still...not a reward for the craft, but rather for the novelty.

Peter Finch was awarded an Oscar posthumously for Network, the difference being that he passed away after he was nominated, but before the ceremony.

I can see that. Still...even Miss America has a runner up if she can't 'perform the duties'.

Though, I suppose I would not want to be known as the 'also ran' and simply making the choice behind the scenes would be just like Batman bugging everyone's cellphones regardless of privacy laws for the 'greater good.'

Ironically parallel example.

Still, I'm not sure I would have come on Lucius' side of that argument either.

More thought required.

Well, yeah, but I love Paper Moon.

There should be a golden ascot award!

Heaven forfend!

I think I've made my stand on ascots quite clear.

I think you deserve an oscar if you're one of my favorite actors and I forget that's you on the screen while I'm watching the movie.

This. If I didn't KNOW that was Heath, I doubt I would have figured it out.

Hm. If I hadn't known that Gary Oldman was Jim Gordon, I wouldn't have figured it out. I don't think that makes him Oscar-worthy. It makes him fucking awesome in that role, but Oscar-worthy? Nah.

And really, I don't find the Joker an Oscar-worthy role. (Plus, I didn't forget for one moment that the Joker was Heath Ledger. I'm sure that was due in large part to the inescapable notoriety of his death, but still.)

(And it's not like I was aware of Heath-the-actor in the same way that, say, I am always, ALWAYS aware of Jim-Carey-the-attention-whore within a role. [Yes, even the mindwipey movie.] Totally different vibe.)

bonny, um.... maybe some spoiler font on that comparison? I'd call that a bit of a plot surprise...

It's only July, most of the Oscar contenders come out in December, but I can't think of a better performance so far this year.

edit: yes I'm still pretending that Oscars are awarded based on how good of a job you did.