Fantasy has its own set of subgenres, but it's more typical taking place in a different world -- often an older or younger Earth-like realm, and almost always in less technologically advanced times.

Does that mean you'd call Emma Bull's stuff magic realism? Brust's Agyar? You equate it with urban fantasy?

Woohoo, erika!

AmyLiz, I read Mr. and Mrs. Bo Jo Jones in high school. I don't have the book anymore, but the mere fact it's one of the few books I read then that I still have vivid memories of says something,

Kristin, I love a good fantasy novel, and I'm planning to write in the genre one of these days.

When you come down to it, it's the basis for BtVS and Angel. Our world, with extraordinary things just beyond the corner of our vision.

I mostly agree with your definition of the differences between magical realism and fantasy. I also prefer magical realism as a literary genre. However, I think when creatures such as vampires and other demons are involved you are more into fantasy/horror than magical realism. Although I do agree that there is some element of magical realism to BtVS and Angel because of the fact that they take place in a real world setting.

However, I think when creatures such as vampires and other demons are involved you are more into fantasy/horror than magical realism.

Ah, but ghosts and vampires aren't other species, or fantasy species: pretty much every culture I know of that has them as belief or legend has them as beings who were once human.

That, right there, puts them in a whole nother class than hobbits and dragons, for me.

Oh, Deb and ita, I'm not saying by any means I'm an expert at the definition. FWIW, I do think there is urban fantasy, too. I think of magical realism as being more subtle, is all. I would agree with sj that having a pervasive magical species (like vampires etc) takes it out of the realm of magical realism and into the realm of fantasy.

Magical realism seems usually dreamy to me--on the edges of reality rather than "in your face".

Woot Woot, erika!!!

I had a fantastic evening. A friend was stuck on a script she's writing for a training film, and she asked if I'd help her troubleshoot it.

My writing time has been sapped by the move and life in general, and my confidence has ebbed with every day I didn't get my pages done.

I was on fire tonight. I knew how to fix her trouble spots, and how to make suggestions without trying to take over her story. She left feeling unstuck and happy.

I might just have a future at this writing gig after all.

YAY Astarte!!!

Magical realism seems usually dreamy to me--on the edges of reality rather than "in your face".

This.

I think it depends on the magical realism - I don't find Alice Hoffman dreamy at all, whereas someone like Laura Esquivel, yes.

Your tastes and takes may vary. Which is why I am backing rapidly out of the conversation, which is beginning to feel like lit crit, and I've already lost one of my favourite threads permanently via that route.

I don't think I've ever tried to draw a line between magical realism and fantasy before; it's always seemed to me that it doesn't matter where something is set or what species the characters nominally are so long as they're in interesting situations and have clearly drawn personalities. For me, "magical realism" set in New York or ancient Greece is fantasy as much as "high fantasy" set in Middle Earth is fantasy, because I've never been to New York or ancient Greece any more than I've been to Middle Earth. And, actually, that extends to places I have been: one author's London will never be the London I've visited, whether they've written magic or simply the past, whether they're Gaimen or Dickens.

After all, Douglas Adam's Rickmansworth isn't my Rickmansworth; there are no small cafes in my Rickmansworth, much to my annoyance.

And personally, I'm unsure that trying to divide sci-fi from fantasy will ever be a productive exercise, and adding a third category of magical realism just seems to confuse the issue. So many of the good ones are always going to be the ones that don't fit the patterns neatly.

YMMV.