Lot's wife? I guess because she was told not to look back? Still seems overly harsh.

What's often overlooked is that in those times there was a severe salt shortage, so there was much rejoicing....

Because he's a just God, he punishes those who deserve it.

I don't think I deserve an infinitely long punishment just because I don't believe in Jesus...

Honestly, *I* can't really address the issue of any person's salvation. Or even my own, really. All I can say about it is that God is mind-blowingly vast, far beyond humans' ability to comprehend.

What one book -- which was written by human beings, and then translated and re-translated and re-translated -- says about salvation (and how a person is "saved") is very very very likely not the whole picture.

God is infinite; I think it's safe to say that he has an infinite number of ways that he can work out with a given person how that person spends eternity.

He doesn't just punish those who deserve it, he punishes their families, thier children, their whole communities, sometimes. And his punishments are, to my mortal mind, often both extreme and arbitrary.

What I find most interesting about this whole conversation, Steph, is that an intelligent educated person like you - someone whose opinions and ideas I can respect - read the Bible the same way I did - "in context, both historical/cultural AND in terms of language" - and came to the completely opposite conclusion.

God's nature in the OT -- which is exactly the same as his nature in the NT -- is both merciful *and* just.

Did I mention all of the dead children, killed because of their relatives or their rulers or just because they live down the street from some jerk? How is this just?

Free will means free will for everyone. God can't give free will to some people but not to others. Shitty people do shitty things.

God is infinite; I think it's safe to say that he has an infinite number of ways that he can work out with a given person how that person spends eternity.

Well, I suspect that when I die my consciousness will cease to exist forever, but hey - if there's a God who wants to grant me eternal life that could be cool....

I don't really relish the idea of eternal life. It sounds sort of boring to me. But then, I'm hard to please.

Free will means free will for everyone. God can't give free will to some people but not to others. Shitty people do shitty things.

What does this have to do with murdering children?

He doesn't just punish those who deserve it, he punishes their families, thier children, their whole communities, sometimes. And his punishments are, to my mortal mind, often both extreme and arbitrary.

I will say that He does come off a bit better than the members Greco-Roman pantheons, who seem to have interpersonal relationships and personalities that wouldn't seem out of place in your average night-time soap. Let's not even get started on how they tend to treat the lowly mortals.

Free will means free will for everyone. God can't give free will to some people but not to others. Shitty people do shitty things.

What does this have to do with murdering children?

Are you talking about God not intervening when people commit murder, or are you talking about God himself smiting a city/tribe/whatever?

Are you talking about God not intervening when people commit murder, or are you talking about God himself smiting a city/tribe/whatever?

I'm talking about God the murderer.