As much as I adore and revere Zelazny, some of his earlier stuff has women characters whose primary purpose is to be attracted to the hero--though he has other women who are tough and have things to do that are important to the plot. And the 2nd Amber series is much better about it. It's like the writers of the 60s and 70s had this huge blank spot in their heads and needed rapped smartly to realize there were a whole lot more characters they could be playing with.

But you're assuming that the SF Valhalla relies on literary quality

Absolutely. It relies on literary quality and imagination. And that's what I loved about Asimov--his concepts. He strung concepts together that intrigued me at a time where I wasn't primed to care too much about literary quality. *Now* I'd prefer both together, but his concepts are still strong enough for me to enjoy his work with the serviceable literary quality he's displayed.

Absolutely. It relies on literary quality and imagination. And that's what I loved about Asimov--his concepts. He strung concepts together that intrigued me at a time where I wasn't primed to care too much about literary quality. *Now* I'd prefer both together, but his concepts are still strong enough for me to enjoy his work with the serviceable literary quality he's displayed.

Yeah, you'd never mistake him for a writer of lush prose, but serviceable is a good word for his writing, and you're totally right about his concepts.

I would re-read Asimov (disclaimer: I had a cat named after him growing up) before a lot of other writers, some of whom may register more strongly on the literary quality scale (whatever that is), but have a failure of imagination. I'll take imagination over imagery most days.

I couldn't get in to Asimov, even as a young person-- but that is unsurprising since the "hardest" science fiction I liked was Narnia. My mother kept buying me science fiction, though.

Yeah, you'd never mistake him for a writer of lush prose, but serviceable is a good word for his writing, and you're totally right about his concepts.

This is the way I feel about George R. R. Martin. He's not an exceptional stylist, but he tells a damn good story.

He's not an exceptional stylist, but he tells a damn good story.

Yeah, I wouldn't rate Asimov as a particularly gripping storyteller either. His ideas were interesting, and apparently still are interesting. It's not that you're swept away by his narrative. Also, Martin like Rowling (another writer who gets dinged for her prose at times) created much more vivid and complex characters, and were better storytellers.

Anyway, I'm not trying to turn anybody to my point. If he's still a good/valuable/enjoyable read to you then that's the relevant answer to my original question.

And Asimov's prose did rise above serviceable on occasion. "The Ugly Little Boy". And another story whose exact title I'm brain farting on: "A nice day for a walk" something on those lines.

And Asimov's prose did rise above serviceable on occasion.

If I want an example of "damning with faint praise" I'd start with this, Gar.

See, I find Martin TL:DR. He's like a sleeping pill for me.

But, then, so is Rowling. And you're talking to someone who routinely can't sleep because OMG, BOOK! MUST READ MORE! So if a book puts me to sleep...

He never did anything for me, but saying so does feel like slagging someone's Uncle Isaac.