Therefore, in dark SGfic, you're not just watching beloved characters in pain, you're also going through a certain loss of innocence

That's it, exactly. I always marvel at what a sunny show SG is, given the stakes. This story imagined the flip-side of it, the ideas the writers on the show might have toyed with but dared not follow through, and took them all the way to their logical, terrible conclusion. Interestingly enough, there has been some debate in the fandom as to whether Daniel as we know him would have ended up in the place where he was at the end of the story, no matter what happened. A lot of people didn't buy that he would go so dark.

I always marvel at what a sunny show SG is, given the stakes.

No kidding. Plus, it's not just the stakes. Some of the characters have deep-seated issues that would give Angel's or Wesley's a serious run for their money.

Jack is trained in Special Ops, i.e. dirty work and bare-hands killing. He lost his only child in a truly horrible way that was sorta-kinda his fault. He's shown in the course of the show that he can make some very hard, very brutal decisions. Yet, his default mode of behavior seems to be that of a slightly hyperactive 12-year-old.

Daniel not only lost his parents at an early age, he also got front-row seats at their unfortunate squooshing. Then there came the foster homes, the wild theories and eventual professional disgrace, etc. He lost his wife twice over--first as she got taken over by a Goa'uld, then as she was killed. We saw, in "Absolute Power" just how much of a bastard Daniel could be, under the right (wrong) circumstances. He died a horrible death, became an ascended being, then lost that, coming back all disoriented and with a shattered memory. Yet, when he came back, he was back to his normal deadpan snark within no time, and he and Jack resumed their whole Burns-and-Allen routine. He's got his angst, but his default mode seems to be that a contented bookworm with a lifetime pass to every library accessible through L-space.

Sam "Black Widow" Carter has lost scores of love interests in various, unpleasant ways. She comes across (to me, at least) as a classic workaholic. As a scientist and as an officer in the military, she's occupying two roles that are still often thought of as "boy's jobs." Her father is now pretty much half-alien. Her scientific goals and military goals are often in conflict. Still, I always get the feeling that she loves what she does, and is in hog-heaven since she basically has access to the best toy store/hobby shop every.

Anyhow...

Basically, what I think I'm getting at is that if a piece of SG-fic is going to create a truly dark scenario and make it work, the author needs to be aware of how he or she is going to tear apart the childlike optimism and wonder that is at the base of the show. I think the same holds true in many ways for due South fic, and will probably also hold true for Wonderfalls fic.

In a way, dark SGfic is like the inverse of schmoopy Buffyfic or Angelfic. If I'm going to write a happy, sappy fic set in the Jossverse, it will only work if there is some acknowledgement of the moral turbulence and uncertainty that runs throughout the show and its characters. I'd say the same thing would apply to X-Files and Farscape fic, but I'm not as familiar with those.

Thoughts? Comments? General mockery?

In a way, dark SGfic is like the inverse of schmoopy Buffyfic or Angelfic.

There's an interesting analogy. Metaphor? Crap, I forgot the word.

Especially if you consider the prevalence of each style in each fandom--dark SGfic is pretty huge, a large chunk of the well-written fic in the fandom. Just as fluffy Jossverse fic is a staple in its fandom. I wonder why.

I wonder why.

Part of it might be because people see the story potential in the unexplored darkness of SG1, while in the Jossverse fandoms, people love the characters and want them to catch a well-deserved break from the hardness and uncertainty of their lives.

Teal'c is "just" on a crusade against false gods, but you know that's a pretty deep issue right there.

Teal'c is "just" on a crusade against false gods, but you know that's a pretty deep issue right there.

Hell, yeah. Plus the whole family thing. I can't believe I left him out of my analysis.

(ETA: And Dana? You never ever should read that story. Ever.)

Way ahead of you.

t goes off to reread (again) the one where Jack and Daniel have the sex with the dog tags

I blame Vonnie and the Stargate people. I just finished reading The Cost of Doing Business. That is one hell of a story. Brutal and unyielding and yet it all makes sense in the end. Takes balls to do that, and again, and again.

My work here is done.

I read that story when I was still in the process of seeing all of Stargate and before I had the TiVo, so there was a lot of recording going on. I happened to have "Tangent" on one of my tapes - that's basically Stargate Does Apollo 13, little peril, little angst, happy ending. Went home and watched the end of the episode five times trying to convince myself that it didn't really happen that way in canon.

Didn't help.

I'm over it now, but it took... a while. Permanently changed my view of Daniel, too. Actually, come to think of it, Maayan and I are talking about the characterization in that story right now in Tripoli's LJ.

goes off to reread (again) the one where Jack and Daniel have the sex with the dog

WHAT?

tags>

Oh. That's okay then.

Excellent analysis, Anne. Daniel, in particular, you would think should be as off-his-rocker as John Crichton or Wesley by now, 'cause he's been through so much. But that's not the Stargate way. I am alternately frustrated and charmed by this aspect of the show.

if a piece of SG-fic is going to create a truly dark scenario and make it work, the author needs to be aware of how he or she is going to tear apart the childlike optimism and wonder that is at the base of the show.

Yeah, I agree with you there. There is A LOT of exaggerated hurt/comfort in SG fanfic, but it mostly ends up well, and... schmoopy. I wouldn't call those darkfic at all. Come to think of it, I *don't* think true darkfic, in which the characters have their spirits broken and remain that way, is that common in the fandom.

The comparison to Due South is interesting. Speranza, in her review of last year's Vividcon, mentioned how the dark-n-tormented fic/vids are incompatible with her view of the DS-verse, no matter how well done they may be. I kind of get that--I mean, I love the kind of fic in which the team is together and happy and ends up saving the day. (Provided the schmoop is a very low-key.) But occasionally, I get a craving for "there but for the grace of God" scenarios like the one Tripoli devised.

Fluff is the norm in Buffy fic? Huh. I wouldn't have thought so, but then, I mostly avoid fluff.

Edited because "frustraged" is not a word. But it totally could be! Like, combination of "frustrated" and "enraged".

As I post and run to class, does Stargate have what's called smarm? It was most common in Sentinel, as far as I know, and it was used to described a story that was supposedly gen, but in which the comfort part of h/c often included a whole lot of physical contact, up to and including kissing.