... I don't think I really think of the two as very separate categories.

But I think I'm looking at narration in a very specialized way. And I don't have the time right now (although I would so rather do this then what I'm supposed to be doing right now!) to be interesting about it, so I'll shut up.

happiness may be defined as cessation of pain, laying down of arms with honor, or any number of other things that don't involve picket fences and all the rest.

Yes. This. 'Winning the fight' is a happy ending. It can have a happy ending, and still offer a lot of loose ends and problems to deal with.

Hey, I still think Triptych had a happy ending. I'm not the best judge of these things.

And happiness may be defined as cessation of pain, laying down of arms with honor, or any number of other things that don't involve picket fences and all the rest.

Oh, absolutely. And I tend to think those are the best kind. I hope I didn't seem to imply otherwise, aside from the very specific case of my own difficulties in hatching happy stories.

If a story doesn't involve some sort of triumph through adversity, even if it's only with a character dying with a secret kept or knowing that a larger victory is assured, then I don't think I could bring myself to bother. People tell stories to try and make sense of hte world, to try to make things turn out right.

People tell stories to try and make sense of hte world, to try to make things turn out right.

Speak for yourself.

I don't try and make things turn out right, I just follow the bouncing cottontail.

I don't have the time right now (although I would so rather do this then what I'm supposed to be doing right now!) to be interesting about it, so I'll shut up.

I'd love to have you be interesting about this topic. Would you be willing to post something when you have the time? I'm always intrigued by your thoughts on fiction and writing.

I find myself getting annoyed that people think there's only one kind of happy ending, with everyone paired off in peaceful domestic bliss.

Wrod. This is especially annoying when interesting plot threads and characterization get jettisoned right before the end so the author can shoehorn in the "happy ending."

I find it hard to differentiate the emotions on the warm-n-fuzzy end in a way that makes for very memorable or interesting writing. I have an extensive vocabulary of shades of dark gray; when I go for happy, it all just comes out... happy.

And amych beautifully articulates something I've felt but haven't been able to verbalize.

I just follow the bouncing cottontail.

No! Leap upon that clueless bunny, wrestle sense from its twitching little person, turn it into a commentary on life, love, reason or the lack thereof!

Or, you know, porn.

Oh, there are normally commentaries on life, revenge, death, issues, etc. Or at least often.

I know my religious beliefs inform a lot of my plot choices/POV things. Of course, I'm not sure how that applies to the porn, but still.

What I don't bother to do is make sense of life, because life is such a nonsensical thing.

I don't have time to scare it up right now, but Livia Balaban, in XF, wrote a Happy Ending story set after Requiem. It's called Cunegund's Restoration, I think, and it's great fun. She did it as a challenge to herself.

Livia's got a bunch of very funny stuff, including two hysterical meta-fics about Mulder as a ficwriter in the mythical SETI Troopers fandom (which bears a striking resemblance to Enterprise).