The price of free expression is that you may hear and see things that you don't like, or that upset you.

And I'm generally fine with that, except all expression still has to pass the community standards test, and this one clearly fails. And frankly, there is not a damned thing wrong with a community deciding that this particular billboard was beyond the pale. Free expression as important to me and GC as it is to you, and we both thought it had no place in public.

But, as I know from watching "This Film Is Not Yet Rated", denying a film-maker a rating really does mean that nobody sees it. But that was really a disgusting billboard. So basically, this whole dumb post is like "Beats hell out of me."

Well, the billboard was commercial speech, so it's not legally protected speech anyway. There's lots of regulations on billboards.

Free expression can be limited privately, which is what seems to be happening.

The difference to me is that you don't have to listen to music, see a movie, watch a tv show, or read a book if you don't want to. While driving down the street, however, billboards are in your face. And this one was way over the line, which is why it was pulled down immediately.

ETA: My point being that I generally agree, Strega, but this was just misogyny at it's worst. If Janet Jackson's nipple leads to big fines (ridiculous IMO), then why should these people be able to put the torture and killing of a woman in our faces and not have some accountability for it?

all expression still has to pass the community standards test

Can a community ever be wrong?

points to Jonestown

Free expression? Please. Businesses are not people. A business has no "right" of free speech whatsoever. They can purchase an ad, and individual people (whose speech does, actually, have some protections) can attempt to get it out of the public eye if they wish. But I cry no tears over a business's free speech.

Can a community ever be wrong?

That question's a bit vague. Can I disagree with a "community decision"? Sure. I don't get a say if I don't live there, though. Even if I do, if more people in the community are in favor of a decision I disagree with than are against, I've had my say but I don't get my way.

Can a community make a mistaken or misguided judgement? Sure, happens all the time. Sometimes bad judgements get corrected later, sometimes they don't.

As far as the film itself goes, I actually don't approve of preventing it from being shown. I may or may not ever see it, but I'm fine with it still being released. The kind of power the MPAA has over this decision is perhaps too much, but that's another discussion. And frankly, I think even without a rating, the movie will get shown and seen. Actually, I'll be surprised if the studio can't come to some sort of agreement with the MPAA over the matter.

I think "community standards" is either vague or mutable. "Marketplace standards" I get, and think they're extremely applicable in scenarios like this. Those standards are measured by the dollar. Even then, you don't know how many sales you lost vs. how many you never had to begin with, etc.

Community standards can be the standards of the majority, but they can quite as easily become inextricable from the standards of the loudest, and that's not something I think is a good rule to be guided by.

Community standards can be the standards of the majority, but they can quite as easily become inextricable from the standards of the loudest, and that's not something I think is a good rule to be guided by.

I certainly agree with that.