Spike? It's you. It's really you! My therapist thought I was holding on to false hope, but…I knew you'd come back. You're like…you're like Gandalf the White, resurrected from the pit of the Balrog, more beautiful than ever. Oh…he's alive Frodo. He's alive.

Andrew ,'Damage'


Spike's Bitches 27: I'm Embarrassed for Our Kind.  

[NAFDA] Spike-centric discussion. Lusty, lewd (only occasionally crude), risque (and frisque), bawdy (Oh, lawdy!), flirty ('cuz we're purty), raunchy talk inside. Caveat lector.


Allyson - Nov 18, 2005 6:34:40 pm PST #5687 of 10003
Wait, is this real-world child support, where the money goes to buy food for the kids, or MRA fantasyland child support where the women just buy Ferraris and cocaine? -Jessica

My brother is a CO in an asylum. His job is to watch monsters all day. One monster spent his childhood in a prison in south america. He was imprisoned with adult men. And so, he's a man made monster. And while I have compassion for the monster, I know that the monster can never be let out. The compassion for him says that he shouldn't be killed, despite things that would have had him put down in Texas by now. And so, the most compassion this young man has ever received has been by prison guards in a US asylum.

The boy who carjacked and kidnapped me was 17, poor, fatheress. I went to court all the time to make sure he went to jail. He got 5 years, and I found that fair. In the time he was out on bail, he ran away and got a girl pregnant. And I felt compassion, but wanted justice for what happened to me.

I found the court to be fair, and helpful to me. They made sure I was reimbursed for medical and missed work, they offered me counseling and protected me. The police were kind and helpful, as was ever judge, attorney, and victim's advocate.

What happened to the boy was fair, and his sentence was decided based on the many factors of the case.

I think what I'm trying to say is that I think a lot of problems with the justice system are one-size-fits-all sentences that don't take all the factors into account.

And mostly, I think the worst thing you can do to punish someone is to put them in a dark, damp place, and tell them they will never order a pizza, drive a car, ride a bike, see the ocean, drink a beer, go to a movie theatre, shower alone, pet a dog, or go to a baseball game ever a fucking gain. Removed from society. Banished. I'd rather be dead.

When the boy who hurt me was sentenced, I was allowed to read a victim's impact statement, and that's pretty much how it read. That for the next five years, I would order pizzas, go to the movies, meet friends for late night club gigs at midnight in Kenmore Square, have a beer and sing American Pie with the other drunks at closing time at the local pub...and not think of him at all.

He was in jail when I was at the Angel wrap party ogling Boreanaz. So there, FUCKO. Justice should be custom made to fit each individual. My justice was fucking Armani.


Kat - Nov 18, 2005 6:39:20 pm PST #5688 of 10003
"I keep to a strict diet of ill-advised enthusiasm and heartfelt regret." Leigh Bardugo

I think what I'm trying to say is that I think a lot of problems with the justice system are one-size-fits-all sentences that don't take all the factors into account.

I think this is true. Also, as I said to you in AIM, I'm troubled by the tendency to try juveniles as adults coupled with mandatory sentences.


Trudy Booth - Nov 18, 2005 6:44:47 pm PST #5689 of 10003
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart

Also, as I said to you in AIM, I'm troubled by the tendency to try juveniles as adults coupled with mandatory sentences.

This notion that juveniles didn't commit violent crimes until a week ago drives me bats. The reason we HAVE a juvenile justice system is that they've always committed crimes and a long time ago we decided that a fact of civilization is that we hold children less responsible than adults.


Astarte - Nov 18, 2005 6:53:26 pm PST #5690 of 10003
Not having has never been the thing I've regretted most in my life. Not trying is.

In my system there would be *one* appeal and it would have to happen within one year of sentencing. If the appeal didn't work, or you missed the deadline...

McMartin Preschool.

IJS.


Trudy Booth - Nov 18, 2005 6:58:38 pm PST #5691 of 10003
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart

McMartin Preschool.

IJS.

He's not claiming this is virtuous or fair, just what he wants.


beth b - Nov 18, 2005 7:16:33 pm PST #5692 of 10003
oh joy! Oh Rapture ! I have a brain!

I understand MM's view 100%. I also really understand the word hardwired. Because I feel hardwired in the other direction. There are lots of people that I can't regret the deaths of. But not sure I can think of anyone that should be killed.

It is a complex feeling even when you are firmly on one side.


Miracleman - Nov 18, 2005 7:19:48 pm PST #5693 of 10003
No, I don't think I will - me, quoting Captain Steve Rogers, to all of 2020

McMartin Preschool.

IJS.

He's not claiming this is virtuous or fair, just what he wants.

Yeah, again...my viewpoint is not "right". It is not compassionate, equitable, or even just. It just is what it is.

And there is an appeal process in "my" system. Just not a long-drawn out "Okay, maybe NINE strikes and you're out" sort of system.

Also, I think Allyson's post is a very good one...and her personal experience example doesn't really speak to what I'm saying. I agree that what the person who carjacked her got was fair and just.

But if he'd killed her instead of stealing her car and badly frightening her...my opinion would be different. And it would be "five years is not enough. A hundred years is not enough. This man should be dead now. Thank you."


beth b - Nov 18, 2005 7:23:52 pm PST #5694 of 10003
oh joy! Oh Rapture ! I have a brain!

I read Allyson's post differently. I read it more as someone who thought the justic system worked.


Miracleman - Nov 18, 2005 7:38:00 pm PST #5695 of 10003
No, I don't think I will - me, quoting Captain Steve Rogers, to all of 2020

I read Allyson's post differently. I read it more as someone who thought the justic system worked.

No, that's how I read it, too. I mean...I guess what I'm saying is my line is very clear and very rigid. Murder. Rape. Children. Cross that line and all that awaits you is a very quick end. When I said her personal experience...and I was referring solely to the carjacking...I meant that her attacker didn't cross that line and so it didn't speak to my defined limit. If that makes any sense.

It's...okay. I have a cousin, he's a few years younger than me. He had a little sister. One day something in his head snapped and he came home, loaded a rifle (my uncle, his father, was a policeman and an avid hunter) and waited. His sister was the first to come home. He shot her in the head and killed her.

He's sick. I mean truly sick...he's on anti-psychotics because during the whole trial and whatnot he was so delusional he would walk into walls attempting to go down hallways that weren't there. He's ill, I get that.

He will be in prison for a very very very long time.

But, gods help me and I hate myself more than a little for this, there is a part of me that would rest easier knowing he was dead.

Because, see...he's still out there. He'll get out one day and maybe he won't take his meds or...anyway. He can't be "fixed", not to the point anyone can say 100% "He will never do this again." And if he were in the ground I could say "He will never do this again."

I know it's wrong, okay? I'm not attempting to sway anyone towards saying "Hmmm...he's got a point, he does." I should be more compassionate and I should be less reactionary and I should be less fearful.

But I'm not. I love my cousin and wish that he could be fixed so that I would never fear him again. I wish that I could look forward to the day he meets Emeline and not want to snatch her away from him or worry that he knows where she lives or something stupid like that. I wish I could find it in my heart to hope that he will be well and to trust that he will be safe...for others and from himself.

But, just as he is a monster, so am I. And my monster would rest better were he as removed as a person can be from this world.


JohnSweden - Nov 18, 2005 7:46:03 pm PST #5696 of 10003
I can't even.

In my system there would be *one* appeal and it would have to happen within one year of sentencing. If the appeal didn't work, or you missed the deadline...

When your daughter is unjustly accused of a violent crime, I'll be with you on the sidewalk protesting to let her free. As long as you haven't managed to have any say with your incredibly wrong-headed approach to justice. Because then, since overworked, under-resourced people made mistakes, she'd be dead. That would suck.