You're a bloody puppet! You're a wee little puppet man!

Spike ,'Smile Time'


Buffy and Angel 1: BUFFYNANGLE4EVA!!!!!1!

Is it better the second time around? Or the third? Or tenth? This is the place to come when you have a burning desire to talk about an old episode that was just re-run.


erikaj - Apr 08, 2005 5:39:28 am PDT #329 of 10457
Always Anti-fascist!

Don't know if I'd do that, but practicallly, yeah. I'd need it to watch DVDs on, at least.


Kathy A - Apr 08, 2005 7:25:11 am PDT #330 of 10457
We're very stretchy. - Connie Neil

Last night, I was hanging out at the Barnes & Noble café, flipping through Ken Tucker’s (TV critic for Entertainment Weekly) new book, Kissing Bill O’Reilly, Roasting Miss Piggy, and came across his listing of the best and worst television mothers and fathers (one in each category from each decade). I can’t remember all his entries, but I loved his list of best moms:

1950s: Donna Stone (Donna Reed Show)
1960s: Aunt Bea (Andy Griffith Show)
1970s: Florida Evans (Good Times)
1980s: Elyse Keaton (Family Ties)
2000s: Lorelai Gilmore (Gilmore Girls)

And, of course, for the 1990s—Joyce Summers!

Not only that, but in the column on the portrayal of sex on network television (or the lack thereof), he said BtVS gave viewers the only believable treatment of sex in modern life, as opposed to the giggly teenage view most other shows provide.


Frankenbuddha - Apr 08, 2005 7:28:11 am PDT #331 of 10457
"We are the Goon Squad and we're coming to town...Beep! Beep!" - David Bowie, "Fashion"

And, of course, for the 1990s—Joyce Summers!

Joyce had her flaws, but consdering she was a single mom raising onetwo daughters, she did good.


§ ita § - Apr 08, 2005 7:29:25 am PDT #332 of 10457
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Oh, god, I hate Lorelai's mothering. Ick.


Steph L. - Apr 08, 2005 7:40:18 am PDT #333 of 10457
Unusually and exceedingly peculiar and altogether quite impossible to describe

Oh, god, I hate Lorelai's mothering. Ick.

I was just about to post that. Way too co-dependent, shading into child-as-parent.


erikaj - Apr 08, 2005 7:40:19 am PDT #334 of 10457
Always Anti-fascist!

I think he's right...in most cases those women, though idealized in various ways, are 'real" in some ways too. I think if MSCL had stayed on, her mom could have had a shot at that...their mom-daughter stuff was pretty right-on, because the show didn't take a side, you know? Like in some teen shows, because we see through Angela's eyes, Angela would be right all the time. Or in some parent shows, Angela would be a gum-smacking "Whatever." PITA that we'd always see Mom "trying so hard" all the time with. But in real life, even good parents care about things for the wrong reasons(that fashion thing). And good teens get snitty and pull away for no reason they understand. My mom's like Joyce crossed with Lois in "Malcolm" And, wrod, on the BTVS sex-depicting.


Anne W. - Apr 08, 2005 7:44:19 am PDT #335 of 10457
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.

I'm kind of curious about the 'worst moms' list, and whether 'worst' means 'worst parent', or 'most unrealistic'.


Kathy A - Apr 08, 2005 8:18:51 am PDT #336 of 10457
We're very stretchy. - Connie Neil

I'm trying to remember who was on the list, and what he used for parameters. I think he defined them as Best and Worst Parent to have had for your own.

I do know that he had Archie and Edith Bunker for worst dad and mom of the 1970s (Archie was abusive, Edith was supporting of his abuse), Danny Thomas's character as worst dad of the 1960s, and Ray Romano's character as the worst dad of the 2000s. Oh, and Dan Connor (John Goodman) was the best dad of the 1990s.


Anne W. - Apr 08, 2005 8:24:18 am PDT #337 of 10457
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.

Ray Romano's character as the worst dad of the 2000s.

This makes me happy.


Kate P. - Apr 08, 2005 8:34:35 am PDT #338 of 10457
That's the pain / That cuts a straight line down through the heart / We call it love

Dan Connor (John Goodman) was the best dad of the 1990s.

Heh. And this makes me happy.