I mean, when Kristen becomes an Oscar winning screenplay writer, and you have dinner with her and you talk about it, would it be considered bragging or is that negated by the fact that you "knew her when"?

It's something that I'm loosely outlining, now, Aimee.

I think what makes the distinction is this: If, say, Colin were suddenly the new hottie lawyer at Wolfram and Hart, and ita posted about hanging out with Colin in a place where people had no context for their relationship, it would be seen by some as bragging.

I only post here and at Whedonesque, so claims that I'm all over the internet talking up that I know Tim Minear is a weird perception. I also seldom discuss Tim outside the context of his career, which is what he publicly discusses. Well, that and beagles.

No one here is aware of the last time I saw Tim, or what we talked about last.

No one here is aware of the last time I saw Kristen, or what we talked about last.

It's not really anyone's business, nor would those conversations be interesting to anyone else, they'd be contextless.

At work, I'll say, "Oh, my friend Tim said that same thing yesterday..." and that's meaningless, because I'm talking to people who know nothing of Tim.

However, once a guy recommended one of Hec's books, and I excitedly said, "OMG, I know David! He's wonderful! I'm totally telling him that you liked his book."

And that sounded to my coworker like name-dropping, and that I was overstating my relationship to Hec.

I definately think I can shape another 4K words out of that. I've namechecked Jilli, I've namechecked erinaceous, and have been fully aware of it, with a wink and a grin.

I think I've got some writing to do. My agent will be so stoked that her notes have sent me off on a good path. I was lost earlier about how I'd work those notes into this piece, but now I'm sure that it's just an additional piece, and I now have the base for the BNF essay that has escaped me.

I also wonder how the living in LA part of it comes through, if it does at all.

Neil Gaiman has namechecked Jilli, so you're in good company there.

Those negative reactions and claims that you're bragging don't surprise me, for all that they also make me roll my eyes, because it feels like exactly the sort of reaction a certain subsection of fandom would have.

I doubt the response would be the same if, say, your friend Tim worked on According to Jim.

If I talk about spending Thanksgiving with ita in Catalina, it's conversation. If I talk about having dinner with Tim, it's bragging.

I find that fascinating.

I find that nuts. Shit, I've spent the bulk of my life hipdeep in famous people. So what? My father was a musician, my sister was a music journalist, I got taken places and was around. Shit happens. If you happened to be Drew Barrymore, would people snipe at you for "namedropping"? All that says to me is, those particular posters are impressed and resentful about being impressed.

Fuck 'em. You know who you know. You care about who, and what, you care about.

But four thousand words, easy. Ought to be a superb essay.

I'm with Deb. Admittedly, it's sometimes awkward to travel in interesting circles, because people don't always perceive the people you're talking about as "real" people, they perceive them as something ephemeral, as though they existed solely within the thing for which they've atttained some degree of fame.

Now, I've known you (cyberspacely speaking) for a good long while now, so when I see you talking about Tim, I mostly read a certain degree of friendliness, a certain degree of fannish enthusiasm, and a certain degree of promotion -- they're all tied together: you met Tim and became friends with Tim through fandom, through an enthusiasm for his work, and because you care, you are inclined to promote. This isn't "starfucking" or any such nonsense.

Now, does someone who doesn't know you get that? Eh, I'm inclined to doubt, for just the reasons I stated above: For a majority of fans, these people only exist within the bubble of what they're known for, as though Tim or Joss or Fury only wrote and directed during their day, and didn't do things like get together with friends for cards, or do laundry or the like. From that fannish angle, they're not real people, but an extension of their work (although the other way around is more true.)

Thus, a reminder that they're human, that they're friends of normal people and eat at normal restaurants and the like, is greeted with suspicion, because it runs counter to the image in their heads.

I'm jealous about you having Thanksgiving with ita -- you braggart!

ita is a bigger star to my mom.(my mom seldom has to *give* asskicking props) Jilli too.(She is a total perkygoth fangirl... I told you about her wondering about batty bathing suits, right? ) She doesn't understand my obsession with TV writers(which admittedly is excessive...I think I talked to LisaH for two days about seeing David Simon on the street once. But he *so* needs to call me.) So when I told Mom that I got e-mail from Tim Minear...she was kind of like "Cool...internet chat, whatever." until I said "Well, Allyson knows him." She might be more excited since we finished "Wonderfalls" which we both loved, if I said "it's his show."

All that says to me is, those particular posters are impressed and resentful about being impressed.

Yes, this. I have been told to my face that it's "so cute the way you can make my life sound cooler than it probably is". I told that person that I was very sorry for them that their life wasn't as interesting to them as mine was to me.

Try not to let those comments get under your skin & drive you crazy. Those people don't have the context for what goes on, and they never will.

Those people don't have the context for what goes on, and they never will.

Yep. Yep. More yep. Jilli is exactly right.