doodly doodly doo.

My grad school (information studies) was very light on actual programming, and fairly heavy on theory. I mean, I learned conceptually what a Markov model is, without learning a thing about how they're worked out (stupid professor), but the idea was to be able to wrap your head around a thing, not to actually build the thing yourself unless so inclined.

Thus, we designed databases by drawing boxes on whiteboards for 8 weeks before being allowed to start farting around in SQL. Of course, I designed a lovely whiteboard database that could not be queried in a useful way, because MySQL couldn't do what I wanted it to do without my learning a whole other semester's worth of code.

It was a win some, lose some type of situation. The prof gave me credit for stumping the computer within the scope of the assignment.

My job positions are basically Tech Monkey types, where a wide base of knowledge is a good thing, because you're mostly the finger for whatever hole springs in the dike.

See, that's what I found my degree gave me. It was years before I had to program in a language I'd learnt there (Modula-2, Pascal, C, FORTRAN, assembler). I figured it taught me how to learn to program, and the database modelling and logic are still invaluable, although I adamantly refuse to code for money these days, what with me not liking to do it and everything.

I'm sure there are times when the person I'm talking to wished I didn't have a CS degree or programming experience, but on the average, I'd not let go of it, not for a second.

I would infinitely rather be reading another book than writing another program.

I went to school to do CS because I loved it passionately. Having had that love since 13 meant that ... oh, a whole lot of free time went into its care and feeding. So the showing up undecided and inexperienced is an alien mindset for me.

bon -- the numbers in law (or law school) are close to 50/50 M/F?

eta:

the idea was to be able to wrap your head around a thing, not to actually build the thing yourself unless so inclined.

This is what it's easier to get in school than in the real world, and what I think too few of my co-workers (1 would be too few, because I'm snippy like that) have, and I cherish.

I went to school to do CS because I loved it passionately. Having had that love since 13 meant that ... oh, a whole lot of free time went into its care and feeding. So the showing up undecided and inexperienced is an alien mindset for me.

I didn't show up inexperienced and undecided. I showed up inexperienced and decided, and only slowly realized that my decisions weren't completely appropriate. Look, I love computers, I love CS, I'm just not a programmer.

All I am saying is that for many people college is where they discover a vocation; they don't necessarily show up with the advanced skills that make that vocation possible. It's rough competing with an alum of the Bronx High School of Science in anything; it's rough competing with a pre-existing programmer in CS.

Most of what I do is programming database stuff.

Where did you get the experience/knowledge necessary for this? On the job?

Yes. I've always found database stuff to be interesting and fun.

How do you feel about your ability to switch up programming platforms, and also to read other people's code?

Not as good as I would like, which is why I wish I had learned more "hard core" languages like Java or C++ in school. But with a little study I can always figure out someone else's code.

I can so see Christopher doing this, it isn't even funny.

Topic!Cindy, I saw the story earlier and immediately thought of your Christopher. You are so very much going to need to hide the car keys.

I didn't show up inexperienced and undecided.

No, but the lady in the article did, and I'm talking about her.

It's rough competing with an alum of the Bronx High School of Science in anything; it's rough competing with a pre-existing programmer in CS.

Absolutely -- which is why, even if that's where you[general you, not Betsy you]'re going to make up your mind, there isn't some mechanism in place to make sure you're not out of your depth.

I was told, for Oxford, to not bother taking the Comp Sci A Level. I'm assuming their course material would reflect that. If the course material in the US doesn't, then someone's falling down on the job.

I've always found database stuff to be interesting and fun.

What position were you initially hired into?

Shrift -- you're in sysadmin?

Heh. Not so much. I mean, sort of, but not really. I'm sort of but not really a database administrator, too. I'm sort of like Files & Records, with added tech-fu and a minor in graphic arts.

Most of my jobs have fallen under the "tech monkey" blanket. I've never been in a position where programming was necessary. I've done break/fix, PC support, software support, technical writing, project management on tech rollouts... I've debugged and implemented code, but never written it for a job.

Sorry I got touchy, ita. I shouldn't have.

I see one of the strengths of the U.S. educational system (at its best) as being late decision-making: you aren't strapped in to the concentration you picked at age 16. Hell, I knew a woman who got a college degree in English, realized she really wanted to be a doctor, took the medical-science core in night school, and then did med school. More power to her.

What position were you initially hired into?

My first database experience came as one of my responsibilities at a company that sold mail-order stuff. I was always digging into our mailing list to pull the most likely prospects and get them into the proper format for them to be printed, and producing sales reports and projections (that were not built into our commercial mail-order software program) by digging into the dBase tables.

When I was in SF I was hired as a temp for my Excel skills. Then our data got too big for Excel so I had to put it into Access. I did a lot of Access stuff for that job, along with a little programming. That led to my job here, which initially was all Access and programming. Then we moved into SQL Server and web database stuff.