Works of fiction can definitely piss me off. I hadn't really considered betrayal until reading a lot of the reactions here -- which I think is a testament, not to the movie, but certainly to the series.

How could Joss have me feel feelings of betrayal? Without launching into meta? He could fuck with Zoe.

And I understand that I have brought so much freaking baggage of my own to the character that I feel I can barely talk about her anymore (not that it'll stop me) -- I feel outside of canon with every utterance, and would be royally pissed (and robbed, which I guess is the key) if Joss reveals anything that'd make me not be able to feel that way about her anymore.

I don't know if this is a good or sane way to approach fiction controlled by anyone else (actually, for my personal self-preservation, it's decidedly not) and I was wondering what drives the ability to be betrayed by fiction in other people. By the fiction, note. Not the meta.

He reached too far in terms of what he had to do for each character, and what I think he felt he owed the fans. Kaylee/Simon was where I think it showed the most.

I liked this Zoe. She felt like my Zoe, and exponentially so after Wash died. Jayne felt okay, but it was mostly the funnier Jayne (snip) he got comic relief. This Simon ... no, not TV!Simon. (snip)

Book? Who the fuck knows? Seemed fine, but I doubt that new viewers will care. Wash -- he was more the conscience than on the show. That's where characters were stripped down for the movie -- most of them are conscience, at different times. In the movie it felt like it was handed to Wash, Book for his brief time, and a bit to Zoe. Everyone else was in it for something smaller than "right."

This was not TV!Mal, at least not all of him.

This is how I feel. Also, the Lean Cuisine Firefly.

I know, I know, I do really understand that things had to be cut, streamlined and changed to get the movie on the screen. For me, and just me, the changes were just too many and cumulative to keep this story in the 'verse.

(Hi back, pink-haired teacher lady!)

I'm not saying I didn't enjoy Sean Maher's new and improved body, but I'm still annoyed that Simon was essentially an entirely different character with a different backstory and everything.

I ADORED this movie, so I'm surprised about the mixed reaction, although I see where people are coming from.

Anyway, my take when the Wash thing happened was that it felt right, because the stakes of a movie are completely different from a series where you have to keep a core of people around for 100 episodes. If everyone had survived that final massacre I think I would have felt betrayed, like I was lied to about how this was much higher stakes than anything that had happened during Firefly.

I agree, bon bon. It's all about the stakes. And like others, once Wash bit it, I was just sure Joss would continue killing off anyone else who was remotely in harm's way. It made the danger that much more real.

I feel outside of canon with every utterance, and would be royally pissed (and robbed, which I guess is the key) if Joss reveals anything that'd make me not be able to feel that way about her anymore.

# The thing with Miranda and the people drugging = most of the viewing audience was not taken with Firefly as presented, and thus fell asleep. The remaining 13% became Reavers. Err. Browncoats. Rabid frothing fans. Whatev.

ahhhhhh ahahahhhhhhhh! LOVE. THIS!

I'm the queen Reaver!

Or maybe Kristen is. We're co-queens.

ita, I've felt betrayed by fiction, most definately. Clarice Starling in the SotL sequel, Buffy after season 5, and a little bit by Cordelia (you're a champion) in Angel.

I don't feel irrational about it, though Buffy season six made me angry at first because I guess I didn't realize just how much I adored Buffy until she changed into that morose, self-destructive, boring 12-stepper.

I don't feel betrayed by Serenity. There was enough time in between the series was I was drunk with a sense of protectiveness (irrational protectiveness) and this.

Works of fiction can definitely piss me off. I hadn't really considered betrayal until reading a lot of the reactions here -- which I think is a testament, not to the movie, but certainly to the series.

I think I would generally say a work of fiction has "pissed me off" or "disappointed" rather than that is has made me feel betrayed. Betrayal is close enough, but it's more of a "you made this great thing and then messed it up/didn't do it justice and why ya gotta be that way?" sort of feeling.

when they first reaver up and head for Miranda, they show an exterior of the ship that shows the cannon, and what looks like a suited person moving at its controls -- did anyone notice that?

yep, noticed it the first time but it didn't quite register. The second viewing--yeah, we decided to do the 220km round-trip again--I was watching for it and Jayne is there in a suit.

I was watching for it and Jayne is there in a suit.

Yet, also in the cockpit clutching Vera.

Sloppy!