All the non-human species have inherent flaws. Elves are obsequious, Centaurs are arrogant, werewolves are murderers.
Can't drink, smoke, diddle my willy. Doesn't leave much to do other than watch you blokes stumble around playing Agatha Christie.
Spike ,'The Cautionary Tale of Numero Cinco'
The Buffista Book Club: the Harry Potter iteration
This thread is a focused discussion group. Please see the first post below for the current topic and upcoming book discussions. While natter will inevitably happen, we encourage you to treat this like a virtual book club and try to keep your posts in that spirit.
By consensus, this thread is reopened specifically to discuss Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows. It will be closed again once that discussion has run its course.
***SPOILER ALERT***
Scrappy - Oct 23, 2007 6:41:27 pm PDT #3229 of 3301
Life moves pretty fast. You don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it.
DavidS - Oct 23, 2007 6:41:43 pm PDT #3230 of 3301
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."
The Goblins were among the other magical creatures in conflict with the Wizards for generations. That the Wizarding world isn't a fairy tale utopia is an important part of the books.
Yes, but the bank could've been run by a consortium of Goblins and Wizards etc. Whereas banking was exclusively the provenance of Jews for a long time because of Christian laws about usury. So by making the Goblins the bankers, and attributing to them key elements of the Jewish stereotype she's reinforcing the equation of Goblins = Jews.
Trudy Booth - Oct 23, 2007 6:42:04 pm PDT #3231 of 3301
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart
The Wizards say these things about any number of species. The prejudices and sterotypes and rights involving Centaurs, House Elves, Giants... its all over the books.
Trudy Booth - Oct 23, 2007 6:42:47 pm PDT #3232 of 3301
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart
So by making the Goblins the bankers, and attributing to them key elements of the Jewish stereotype she's reinforcing the equation of Goblins = Jews.
Or possibly Chinese if you're Jamaican.
Typo Boy - Oct 23, 2007 6:48:27 pm PDT #3233 of 3301
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.
The Wizards say these things about any number of species. The prejudices and sterotypes and rights involving Centaurs, House Elves, Giants... its all over the books.
They don't just say these things. In many cases, within the universe of the book it is true. Humans have flaws as individuals or organizations. Other species have flaws as species. Fits what I said about good intentions, but hasn't really thought about diversity. Why not have a particular tribe of centaurs be ultra-proud and touchy rather than all centaurs? Why have all (or all but one) house-elves be willing, nay enthusiastic, slaves? And so on....
Trudy Booth - Oct 23, 2007 6:50:44 pm PDT #3234 of 3301
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart
The world is from the POV of the wizards, not an omnitient unbiased entity.
Connie Neil - Oct 23, 2007 6:52:53 pm PDT #3235 of 3301
brillig
The world is from the POV of the wizards
The POV who gets most of his wizard knowledge second-hand, at that. Hermione pretty much proves that the wizarding world is an unreliable narrator in re: house elves.
Trudy Booth - Oct 23, 2007 6:55:02 pm PDT #3236 of 3301
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart
It would be hard for Dumbledore to have problems with the various prejudices if there were none.
Typo Boy - Oct 23, 2007 6:55:06 pm PDT #3237 of 3301
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.
As far as I know Hermione can only get house-elves to seek freedom by tricking them. That seems to confirm the wizard view stereotype.
Connie Neil - Oct 23, 2007 6:56:46 pm PDT #3238 of 3301
brillig
That seems to confirm the wizard view stereotype.
True, it's not a perfect example. But she's willing to take the preconceptions and try to shake the truth out of them. She's just not willing to see the unwelcome results of her shaking.