That cite is a total contradiction:

An imaginary place or state in which the condition of life is extremely bad, as from deprivation, oppression, or terror.

A work describing such a place or state: “dystopias such as Brave New World” (Times Literary Supplement).

Point to "the condition of life is extremely bad" or "deprivation, oppression, or terror" in Huxley's novel. Just because it's become a byword for dystopia, doesn't mean it actuall is one...

I'll add my two cents, for a total of...whatever that makes now. (Shudder...mathiness.) We have a great list of recs, but I'm eager to jump in, and I don't mind at all someone picking the first book (or the first couple).

After that, I thought the idea of picking a selecter (at random, from a pool of those who would like to be chosen, maybe?), who would then offer two or three books for the rest of us to consense on, sounded good.

And while I think an accessible, available classic or two might be appropriate in the first few months, I agree with Cindy that we should mix it up a little, too.

But in the end, however we end up choosing books is fine with me. I just want to begin.

Edited for a typo and to add a point.

Point to "the condition of life is extremely bad" or "deprivation, oppression, or terror" in Huxley's novel.

Show me where there wasn't oppression?!? It may have been kinder, gentler oppression through drugs and conditioning, but it was oppression, just the same, wasn't it? Heck. Human reproduction (natural pregnancy) was a grand disgrace, wasn't it? People were genetically engineered to be mentally deficient, so that they would be happy performing menial tasks.

I think I read BNW in tenth grade, and I'm 37 now, so I may be off. But even though on the surface everything was smooth in BNW, wasn't the whole point that these people were oppressed. Their fertility was not their own. Their genes and fates (that which they received from their parents, so that the government developed different socio-economic classes in the lab, to serve different purposes) were controlled by the government. Their moods were not their own (they were all on happy pills as a matter of course, and were conditioned to believe they were happy, weren't they?). They couldn't speak out. Didn't the choices amount to conformity or death?

Nope. Conformity or exile to the Island.

But the point is that they were happy (though not free). Yeah, to us - as to the Savage - it looks like an oppressive hell, but how can you call a society where 99.99% of the populace is blissfully happy, and the remaining .001% get to live in peac on a tropical island, anything but utopia?

As fascinating as the utopian discussion is, we haven't picked a book to discuss yet. Literary might be a good place to discuss dystopia/utopia as expressed in Orwell's books, though.

Now that's what I call oppression...

One person's oppression is another person's attempt to get a thread with a very specific purpose onto its feet without too many problems.

The dystopia/utopia discussion is making me think Brave New World and Those Who Walk Away From Whileaway could be read together.

That was a joke, Connie.

I think we've consensed that Wolfram should do the first pick honors if he's up for it , which I think he said he was. Sound right?

Thanks for getting that all together, -t and Cindy.