No power in the 'verse can stop me.

River ,'War Stories'


The Minearverse 3: The Network Is a Harsh Mistress  

[NAFDA] "There will be an occasional happy, so that it might be crushed under the boot of the writer." From Zorro to Angel (including Wonderfalls and The Inside), this is where Buffistas come to anoint themselves in the bloodbath.


Betsy HP - Jan 26, 2005 11:30:59 am PST #4089 of 10001
If I only had a brain...

So, it's sort of a communal "it takes a village" approach with the word marriage and some seniority rules attached?

Right. It's a gedankenexperiment. What happens if you do Australia all over again, but this time without the Christianity and with women having the right of sexual refusal? Heinlein's thesis is that you come up with lots of alternate forms of marriage, most of them polygynous.


-t - Jan 26, 2005 11:31:04 am PST #4090 of 10001
I am a woman of various inclinations and only some of the time are they to burn everything down in frustration

I think he meant racially as in "human race". But I'm guessing.


Strix - Jan 26, 2005 11:37:15 am PST #4091 of 10001
A dress should be tight enough to show you're a woman but loose enough to flee from zombies. — Ginger

Does overpopulation as a potential threat to survival ever enter the equation?

He does a spiel about Mathusian theory in TSbtS, um, and in a lot of his stories, overcrowding is a main reason humans colonize the Moon, and go into space in general. And in I Will Fear No Evil, people get assigned how many kids they're allowed to have.

But he implies that the people who follow the Luna-type marriages are Just Too Smart to overpopulate.

EDIT

MALTHUSIAN theory


Betsy HP - Jan 26, 2005 11:45:16 am PST #4092 of 10001
If I only had a brain...

And in I Will Fear No Evil, people get assigned how many kids they're allowed to have.

Also in Podkayne of Mars. Whose point, according to the unabridged edition, was that Silly Girls Shouldn't Expect To Have It All. I think I'll stick to the abridged edition, ta ever so.


aurelia - Jan 26, 2005 11:53:30 am PST #4093 of 10001
All sorrows can be borne if you put them into a story. Tell me a story.

human race

Okay, that makes more sense.


Strix - Jan 26, 2005 12:09:04 pm PST #4094 of 10001
A dress should be tight enough to show you're a woman but loose enough to flee from zombies. — Ginger

Oh, that made me so mad. And I loved the book up to that point.


Matt the Bruins fan - Jan 26, 2005 12:16:53 pm PST #4095 of 10001
"I remember when they eventually introduced that drug kingpin who murdered people and smuggled drugs inside snakes and I was like 'Finally. A normal person.'” —RahvinDragand

But he implies that the people who follow the Luna-type marriages are Just Too Smart to overpopulate.

I think it has less to do with being smart and more with helping raise like 20 other people's kids from the minute one joins the daisy chain. Best birth control method, ever.


dcp - Jan 26, 2005 1:15:36 pm PST #4096 of 10001
The more I learn, the more I realize how little I know.

I think Heinlein enjoyed provoking people--provoking them into thinking about things they took for granted, their assumptions, and possible alternatives.

I don't think he necessarily expected his readers to agree with what he wrote. I seem to recall remarks in an essay (I'm not sure if it was by Heinlein or about him) about not mistaking a storyteller's product for his personal opinions, but I can't find the quote.

I think Heinlein wanted readers to think about why they agreed or disagreed.

In TMiaHM he did that with the purpose, form, and function of government on a small scale (the family) and on a large scale (the nation).

There are two quotes that have stuck with me since I first read TMiaHM as a teenager:

"Under what circumstances is it moral for a group to do that which is not moral for a member of that group to do alone?"

and

"Don't reject the idea merely because it seems preposterous--think about it!" [emphasis mine]


Allyson - Jan 26, 2005 1:40:00 pm PST #4097 of 10001
Wait, is this real-world child support, where the money goes to buy food for the kids, or MRA fantasyland child support where the women just buy Ferraris and cocaine? -Jessica

"Don't reject the idea merely because it seems preposterous--think about it!" [emphasis mine]

Yes. We'll all think about a great big orgy with our second cousins once removed, Bob.

The thing that makes me most want to bust Heinlen in the teeth is the smarmy way he covers up the fact that all he wants to do is fuck and not pay taxes by pretending to be a great philosopher.

WhatEV, Bob. If you want to hump your in-laws, that's cool. Just don't try to tell me it's an important part of a great libertarian utopia that is of course the right way to go. But no, you're not serious, you just want me to think, but I can't really think Bob, when of course all I want to do is marry into your family and carry your seed, as is my role.

Silly me. *gigglelolomigod*


Allyson - Jan 26, 2005 1:59:17 pm PST #4098 of 10001
Wait, is this real-world child support, where the money goes to buy food for the kids, or MRA fantasyland child support where the women just buy Ferraris and cocaine? -Jessica

Wow. I wonder if I've transferred a portion of my Dubya hate to Heinlen, because I found it so impossible to hate someone so much that I had to wring out the excess onto Heinlen.