And I don't think Drogyn's dead. Even Angelus wasn't able to kill any "good" guys this last time around. I doubt Angel could justify it even for the greater good.

Unlike (24 spoiler) Prez Palmer and Jack Bauer.

That's going to reflect badly on the hour I spent on Angel last week.

Ayup. The A plot was strange in tone, and unintegrated in terms of content.

Spike had to raise his hand first. He's already killed himself to stop a wave of evil. And he loved it.

It occurs to me that making the Senior Partners think he willingly sacrificed Fred to spring an Old One might be a very handy bluff for Angel in terms of keeping them off his back after the circle buys it. We know he'd never sacrifice an innocent to call forth another, but our trio of Mr. Burnses might not think that way if he seems sufficiently ignoble in the fight against them. So far as I'm aware, Jasmine and Illyria are the only things they've ever seemed personally nervous about.

What did Lindsey say, specifically, about Black Thorn? Because as some are positing, he wanted to join Black Thorn to bring them down, just like Angel. Which would make more sense to me than wanting to join for the power, as I initially thought.

Frogyn cannot lie when asked directly. This does not mean he cannot tell selective truth when he is not asked directly. Still technically not lying.

I'm just putting it out there as a possibility, because that would explain the fact Angel is willing to kill him.

Hey now - I wanked first! Um.

Take a closer at look at Drogyn just before he was bitten. Not only has his hair thinned, it's changed colour. I read his last "thank you" as gratefulness for the end of his life.

Frogyn cannot lie when asked directly.

Now I'm imagining wee puppet man Angel draining Kermit before snapping his neck. Hee.

Drogyn looked oddly like James Marsters. Kept distracting me.

he wanted to join Black Thorn to bring them down, just like Angel.

This is the only goal that makes sense in light of his efforts to bring down the SP's during the first half of the season. If he'd been trying to join the Stonecutters in order to work with them, he presumably wouldn't have had to hide it from his potential employers.

This is the only goal that makes sense in light of his efforts to bring down the SP's during the first half of the season. If he'd been trying to join the Stonecutters in order to work with them, he presumably wouldn't have had to hide it from his potential employers.

Exactly. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the fact that Lindsey's plan might have made sense. I was getting used to nothing making sense.

I don't think Lindsey's spoken a single sense-making sentence this whole season. And I found it more than a little annoying.